City would have indeed been delighted to have done what Liverpool had done but City fans and Liverpool fans have had a very different level of expectancy over the years and still do.

Remember, it's not that long ago that United had finished way off the pace, in third, behind Chelsea and Arsenal and so-called experts predicted their demise, the fans were in uproar about Glazer and the place was not a happy camp. They've won three league titles since and what has that vital "net spend" been since? You may not like the comparison but it just goes to show.

Let's face it, apart from Gerrard and Torres, how many of your players would any top club clamber to have in their side? Not only does the squad outside the 1-11 not look good enough for the top, the team is nowhere near of the standard required. Have you ever known a top side be so heavily reliant on the fitness of just two players? There's only one bloke who's fault that is.

Yeah, because Gerrard & Torres save goals, control games and do everything.

They're our best players, they're arguably the two best in the league, we're obviously going to be reliant upon them more than any of our other players; however, I do believe some of our other players get little credit for what they do. Benayoun is class, he's always creating stuff yet he's barely spoken of; why? Mascherano is one of the finest players around at doing what he does, the amount of games he keeps us in with his work rate and tenacity really does pass most people by.

IMO, Reina, Agger, Skrtel, Aurelio, Johnson, Mascherano, Benayoun, Gerrard and Torres are all easily good enough for the top sides. It's the rest of the squad we fall short on. We have some players who are boarderline top quality, like Kuyt, Carragher (now he's starting to get on) and Insua's still very raw.

I still believe we'll finish top 4, quite comfortably actually, but we're just gonna have to ride out this next month or so.

Aye.



I agree.

Jesus pal, he's not even as good as the top sides understudy, and i'm being serious.

Evra (Fabio), Clichy (Gibbs), A.Cole (Zhirkov).

Him & Lucas, possibly two of the worst Brazilians I've seen, Lucas is just so unbrazilian it's insane.

You're right though, Liverpool do have further quality than just the two players often spoken about, over the last three years or so, they've arguably been the most defensively sound side in the Premiership, perhaps to the detrement of the attacking stuff.

It's the lack of width (your wide players are all out to in rather than the other way, none offer genuine width, your best, Benayoun, does his best work roaming, being difficult to pick up etc), lack of options, and lack of squad depth that's the killer. With over 150 transfers during his reign, he should have rectified these glaring, glaring problems.

You got evidence that the money was used for other things. Maybe what Fergie said was true, that the players he wanted to sign were valued too high and he wasn't prepared to pay over the odds.

[url=http://www.thespoiler.co.uk/index.php/2009/11/06/man-utd-named-the-best-supported-club-in-europe#more-10224Best supported clubs in Europe[/url

United 1st, Arsenal 7th, Borussia Moenchengladbach 19th...... Scousers 23rd

Watch Aurelio more. Seriously, I rarely remember a Liverpool performance where any winger's had the better of him, and we've played some top sides. His passing is solid and his crossing is excellent, he's not the quickest, but he's been a class signing on a free, despite some terrible luck with injuries.

I also believe wide players are the problem. Riera is the only real natural wide player, whilst he's good, he struggles with inconsistency due to lack of any competition for his place. I'm not gonna hide it, I'm not a fan of Dirk Kuyt out on the right. I don't mind him through the middle against small teams, or on the right away in big games in Europe, but other than that, I feel he's too limited to warrant a role on the wing. I'd love to see Rafa throw Pacheco on the left/right, in a Benayoun style role, his passing and dribbling is as good as anything at the club, even if he is only pint sized. I think our lack of width has kind of been addressed with the signing of Johnson, but our midfield hasn't been able to control games the way we did with Alonso, we've not been able to swing the ball from side to side, probing like we did so often last year. As I said, I believe once everybody's fit, we'll be a better side than last season, but missing the X amount of players we do right now, we're down to the bare bones, last year when we got injuries, it was easier for somebody like Lucas to come in, play 2-3 games and we'd still win, we were high on confidence and the ball was rolling, but this year we started with players injured, unfit or just needing a rest, we weren't able to get on a roll and we're playing like you see now.

I believe we'll finish the second half of the season extremely strong, much like last year, however, our current form much depends on when we can get the big guns on the pitch and playing together, at the moment, Benny and Torres are carrying us.

have you taken these results from attendances at these grounds.

although i dont like Liverpool they cant actually fit anymore into Anfeild, they reach capasity every week i think, if they had a bigger ground i'm sure they would be amongst the best supported.

The money has gone to pay the debt.

Even if the cu*t gives Fergie £20m in January, there has been £60m + from this summers budget unspent paying interest on the debt. The sooner they fu*k off the better.

thats an idea now i just need an iphone

Damn. Our ground isn't as big as Moenchangldbach so we aren't as well supported as them. Best give up now.

You also didn't selectively pick out Chelsea being 27th. I wonder why.