Fergie was very lucky to get 4 years to win a trophy and 6 years to win the league at the start with Man United.

Wenger has been very lucky to have got the 7 years (and counting) of trophyless seasons without serious risk to his job.

Mourinho committed the crime of just winning the FA Cup for Chelsea (after two seasons of winning the league) and he was out of the door.

He could very easily win the league again with Real and be out of the door for not winning the CL.

IMO I don't think Mourinho leaves Real without being sacked unless he wins the CL.

Even with Mourinho's record, there's no way he'd get 3 years at Real to build the club for long term success. They don't like him enough, he doesn't like them enough. I think he leaves after winning the CL with them or they just get rid of him because they didn't score 25 Maradona-type 30 yard dribbled goals that season (they actually got 24 and the ref disallowed the 25th because Ronaldo was part tripped on the way so he took it back for a free kick).

If Mourinho wins La Liga this year and has another CL semi defeat, gets sacked, then many people will put that down as a Mourinho failure.

Even if Mourinho wins the CL with Real this season many people will stay say that it was too easy anyway and still say Fergie is better.

Good to see Di Natale hasn't lost any of his class. Caramelised Liverpool in that second half.

For all the commentators went on and on about how well Liverpool played again, it's such a poor team. Rodgers would probably be outstanding at a club like Madrid, Barca or Chelsea. But he has to realise his way of playing isn't going to work with those players. Downing, Henderson, Allen, Assaidi in midfield? Not one of them did anything. Downing in particular has completely lost whatever he had before his Liverpool move, he's now a poor man's James Milner. Allen's a decent water carrier, it's useful to carry one of those if you have 4 or 5 world class attacking players, but when you've got none it doesn't really matter that he shovels balls between Downing and Assiadi all night does it? Jamie Carragher still playing in 2012? He's the football version of Paul Wellens, it's an absolute farce that he's still strolling around in a Liverpool shirt.

Borini is a mystery, how on earth did he score in Serie A? If I was in charge there I'd stick Sahin in midfield with Shelvey with Gerrard up front with the Suaz. He's got no legs any more so him pretending he's a box to box midfielder is a waste of energy for him. Stick him right up front and get him on the end of all the half chances Suarez and Borini mess up, like Everton did with Fellaini early in the season.

Rodgers has moaned on about Suarez not getting penalties because he's got a reputation as a diver. He brings him on and he jumps 4 feet into the air, with pike, twist and a flawless landing complete with roll and screaming and he didn't even touch him. He must be tearing his hair out.

What Fergie did at Aberdeen was fantastic. Although I'm not sure their previous 2nd place league finish is quite the obscurity you claim.

I'm not diminishing Fergie's success at Aberdeen, I was simply comparing the 10 years that Mourinho has managed with the last 10 years of Fergie's reign.



Even though Man United were poor when he came, they were still the biggest and most powerful club in the country. I remember Nigel Kennedy, the celebrity violinist Villa fan, saying at half time of a televised game that if Man United ever got it right on the pitch, the size of the club made them untouchable.

Fergie was given the time and the money to make them untouchable. Sky TV made them even more powerful. The CL made them even more powerful.

Liverpool face far more challenges than Man United did. They face the competition of Man United, Abramovich's Chelsea, the Sheikh's Citeh and Arsenal. They cannot expand their ground like Man United were able to. In the modern game, there's no way that a manager will get 4 years of trophyless football to build. Dalglish, one of the club's biggest legends, was turfed out after winning the League Cup and reaching the FA Cup Final.

2012 LFC is just not comparable to 1986 Man United.



I don't know when the Kennedy comment was, but just from what he said I suspect it was before they'd won their first title under Fergie.



More down to Abramovich screwing up and messing with Mourinho, then getting rid of him. Blackburn were built for one title and then Walker was happy. Citeh, we'll see.



He can be lauded as the better manager because he's won more trophies, at 4 different clubs, in the last 10 years. He's equalled Fergie's CL in half the time it took Fergie.

What dynasties are there to create? Man United were unique in their history, their lack of success and their potential. Fergie didn't create it, he was just lucky to be given the time and resources that the sleeping giant could be awoken again.



It was Chelsea's screw up that they got rid of Mourinho. The fact he's won titles at Inter and Real, and the CL at Inter show just what Chelsea should have been holding on to.

As I've said, LFC 2012 is not the same as MU in the 80's. They need a brand new, ~£300m stadium and a couple of hundred million on the field. Unless there's another Arab sniffing around, they ain't getting it. And even if they did the competition is so much stronger now than it was.

Obviously Fergie's age is an issue, but no one would suggest that he should go to Liverpool and do there what he did at United. Because he'd fail at that just like anybody would.

Seriously Saddened, why do you even bother? Sheer dross as ever.

Felt we played well tonight but again, our biggest problem remains our defence and our inability to control the opposition without the ball. We attack well and create plenty of chances, we've outplayed most of the sides we've played this year (apart from Arsenal), the problem remains keeping them out. In the past, even if we couldn't break a side down, we'd keep a clean sheet easily, but that solidity is now gone and teams are free to go at us however they want. It was another one of those 'luck' nights tonight, Suarez's free kick was magisterial but our own poor defending never gave us a chance.

Udinese were rank average tonight, they were the stereotypical Europa league side, but they turned up, got three points and didn't play at all well. We played well but lost, the balance isn't there and the solidity at the back is missing. A lot of talk is about bringing in a striker in January, but I'd look at a centre half if Wisdom or Kelly aren't going there.

My employers were offering Udinese at 5/1 early yesterday. Suffice to say that were I tha gambling type, I'd have been all over that. Outrageous value

I understand what you're saying. That basically he's a quick fix guy that disappears before he's found out. There may be truth to that but we'll see at Madrid. If he suddenly rattles off eight league titles in a row with a few CL thrown in then there's going to be little point discussing his greatness. I don't think you can talk about changing the club from top to bottom though because not all managers do that and to exclude one just because he doesn't shouldn't undermine his achievements either. Footballers don't have to play through all of the ranks to be considered great so what purpose does it serve to say managers should, other than to support the appointment of Brendan Rodgers

You don't even read what I put. I'll bet you can't really, honestly, disagree with any of what I put.

Footballers are a thick bunch. Don't they learn?? www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/footba ... ealed.html

Footballers are a thick bunch. Don't they learn?? www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/footba ... ealed.html

Embarrassing, as ever.

Care to explain why? The FA had no evidence and a court case that had already ruled insufficient evidence to prove guilt, yet they banned him anyway. Why is that embarrassing?

No idea if you're actually been serious or not, but there is a fairly significant difference between "beyond all reasonable doubt" and "on the balance of probabilities" as a burden of proof.

But then you knew that already didn't you.

The only thing that's embarrassing here is that he only got 4 games because he only called him an "FBC" once!

Terry will appeal. He'll ultimately win the appeal. The public will still hate him, in fact they'll hate him more because he's escaped "justice".

Cole will be fined for his tweet.

probably right about JT - a fine footballer IMO but someone who doesn't exactly endear himself to the general public and as for some other members of his family...

Cole will be let off lightly because he's integral to to the England team - there is no way one of the best FBs in world football will be banned from playing for his country - if the culprit had been say, Leighton Baines or Phil Jagielka or any other border line international then he probably would never wear the three lions again - a bit like the Kevin Pieterson debacle

The precedent fine set for Rio Ferdinand's "choc ice" comment will probably be applied to Cole.