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International Board Member | 20548 | No Team Selected |
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| Quote Itchy Arsenal="Itchy Arsenal"Who would you replace him with?
MMs message didn't work in the last few months of his tenure when we played very conservatively and lost twice to an average saints team with a far far better squad than we have today.
This looks like our year of transition which arguably is overdue. I know our performances are poor at the moment and any defeat literally ruins my weekend but we just need and try to be patient and at least give SW the opportunity to turn it around. We have got to give him a season not five or six rounds.
If we fail to qualify for the top 8 then he will go.
Failure to achieve the top 4 he will be on thin ice.'"
Why should we be in a season of transition? I don't really get that.
Please clarify.
In relation to who should replace Wane I dint think the time is right for Edwards, for me Walters or Kearney would be great choices.
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Player Coach | 3003 | Wigan Warriors |
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Jul 2008 | 17 years | |
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| Quote jonh="jonh"Why should we be in a season of transition? I don't really get that.
Please clarify.
In relation to who should replace Wane I dint think the time is right for Edwards, for me Walters or Kearney would be great choices.'"
Can we afford Edwards? If he would come back would probably be my hearts choice of a replacement.
What has Walters achieved?
What has Kearney achieved managing a club?
Transition equals new 6, exit of two props with no direct replacements, Sarginson 2nd season at centre - ain't played a full season there yet, SOL a year older and will play fewer matches, still haven't replaced Carmont, Burgess having "second season" syndrome, Tomkins back but played out of position more times than not, trying to play as if we still have Sam. Is that enough?
What transition did MM have? Strengthening of the squad in year 2 and our play after the CC final was pretty dismal.
We have an inexperienced squad that needs a bit of luck, hard graft and time. If we fail to make the 8 even with all the changes SW will go.
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Player Coach | 555 | Wigan Warriors |
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| We can afford Edwards if IL "splashes the cash". I am pretty certain there is no limit on what you pay your coach and backroom staff. The salary cap only applies to playing staff.
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Club Coach | 29988 | Wigan Warriors |
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Nov 2004 | 20 years | |
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| Quote Fames="Fames"We can afford Edwards if IL "splashes the cash".'"
Never a sentence that fills me with much hope!
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| Quote Itchy Arsenal="Itchy Arsenal"Can we afford Edwards? If he would come back would probably be my hearts choice of a replacement.
What has Walters achieved?
What has Kearney achieved managing a club?
Transition equals new 6, exit of two props with no direct replacements, Sarginson 2nd season at centre - ain't played a full season there yet, SOL a year older and will play fewer matches, still haven't replaced Carmont, Burgess having "second season" syndrome, Tomkins back but played out of position more times than not, trying to play as if we still have Sam. Is that enough?
What transition did MM have? Strengthening of the squad in year 2 and our play after the CC final was pretty dismal.
We have an inexperienced squad that needs a bit of luck, hard graft and time. If we fail to make the 8 even with all the changes SW will go.'"
Kearney and Walters are working under the best in the business, what had Madge achieved before joining Wigan? We need NRL input in my opinion, work on skills tactic quality.
In relation to it being a transition season not many would have said that a month ago it was all positive we have a top squad etc.
Even if it is as you say a transitional season it didn't need to be there were plenty of players on the market we could have signed in the positions you quote that would do a job for us, Burns and Campese at 6 Simms, Vea, Pea, etc. instead we have sat on our hands and followed this ridiculous succession policy.
I have said it in the past the Wigan youth system is outstanding, without doubt but a great youth system and fielding a full home grown team doesn't get you trophies. How long will we continue to chase rainbows?
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International Chairman | 32371 | Wigan Warriors |
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| Quote Fames="Fames"Agree totally. And I don't buy into the " he's too young/inexperienced" argument, which is often put forward by some.
In my opinion, if you are good enough, you are old enough as a back. I posted on another thread that Sean Edwards was Wigan's number 6 and also Captain in 1988 when only 21. Half backs such as Andy Gregory was starring for Widnes as an 18/19 year old. Sinfield, McGuire, and Burrows were all playing regularly for Leeds aged 20. It is in the forwards, particularly props where age is an advantage - but that is more to do with physique and natural "filling out" rather than experience per se.
Some have posted Wigan do not want to make the same mistake that they made with Kevin Brown, Robinson etc when they were played at half back "too young" and were found wanting and eventually sold. I would argue that it wasn't because they were too young - but that they simply weren't good enough.
Hampshire should be given the opportunity at 6 - if he isn't good enough, ok. The bottom line is Wane has tried all other half back combinations apart from Williams at 7 and Hampshire at 6 this season. This partnership has enjoyed success at all levels they have played at so far - I repeat, if they are good enough, they are old enough. I think they would prove that if given the opportunity, particularly behind a full strength pack. And this would also make opposing teams worry more about the threat posed by 2 half backs who can both take the line on and are fast, particularly Hampshire.'"
At the age of 20 McGuire had started 1 game in the first team, Sinfield 19 and Burrow 16. Sinfield didn't play in the halves. Also Leeds signed Andre Dunemann when McGuire and Burrow were 21 years of age. Dunemann was there for three years and made more starts than either of them.
Hampshire has started 11 for Wigan and were only five games into the season so his starts compare favourably with Burrow and McGuire.
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Player Coach | 862 | No Team Selected |
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| Quote Fames="Fames"
The bottom line is Wane has tried all other half back combinations apart from Williams at 7 and Hampshire at 6 this season. '"
Isn't this the problem? There's no settled half back combination which disrupts the ability to get the timing of various plays right. Time and time again we see teams struggle when the half back pairing is disrupted, Saint's last year, whenever we have Lockers in at 6 and so forth.
I didn't get to Hull last week but from what I hear and read, Wigan were dominant but timing was out.
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International Chairman | 32371 | Wigan Warriors |
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| Quote goobervision="goobervision"Isn't this the problem? There's no settled half back combination which disrupts the ability to get the timing of various plays right. Time and time again we see teams struggle when the half back pairing is disrupted, Saint's last year, whenever we have Lockers in at 6 and so forth.
I didn't get to Hull last week but from what I hear and read, Wigan were dominant but timing was out.'"
I've mentioned it a few times to friends when discussing the current season. It looks to me as though Wigan have done a lot of fitness training but not enough actual ball work.
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International Chairman | 5392 | Wakefield Trinity |
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| I'm happy to see that others are beginning to see the limitations of Wane has as a coach.
My main bug bear is I don't think he's getting the most out of our current group of players. Yes I don't think that we are as strong as in recent seasons but we are certainly better than current form suggests.
The Hampshire situation, imo, sums up how Wane is making life harder than it needs to be. We have the current England academy 6 in Hampshire who is a natural attacking player.
I see the reservations about playing a kid BUT he's got plenty of quality and experience around him in the side. Smith is the current England 7, Sarg is a current England Centre and he's got the whole English back row to work with. It's not like it's a team of also rans that we have.
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Club Coach | 29988 | Wigan Warriors |
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| Logan Tomkins is in the team tonight so it's a safe bet Hampshire isn't.
He'll need more injuries to get anywhere near a spot that isn't fullback.
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Administrator | 25122 | No Team Selected |
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| You are putting way too much pressure on these kids. Expectations are sky high. Wane is absolutely right to keep the youngsters on ice. When high expectations collide with unpredictable reality careers can be destroyed before they've even begun.
Look at what happened to Gaskell at Saints. First season he's instrumental in getting the club to a GF (against the odds, I might add)
Today he's playing for Bradford.
And it's nothing to do with ability (or lack thereof). The lad has it in spades.
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Player Coach | 3813 | No Team Selected |
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| Quote Mugwump="Mugwump"You are putting way too much pressure on these kids. Expectations are sky high. Wane is absolutely right to keep the youngsters on ice. When high expectations collide with unpredictable reality careers can be destroyed before they've even begun.
Look at what happened to Gaskell at Saints. First season he's instrumental in getting the club to a GF (against the odds, I might add)
Today he's playing for Bradford.
And it's nothing to do with ability (or lack thereof). The lad has it in spades.'"
He's playing really well for Bradford though (including last season against better opposition). He'll be back with a top-4 Super League club next season, I'd wager.
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