FORUMS > Wigan Warriors > Tomkins best player...... |
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| Quote: Grimmy "Easier to do a 17 IMO. You can't really compare props with wingers etc.
For me since 01
1. Radlinski
2. Charnley
3. Renouf
4. Carmont
5. Richards
6. S.Tomkins
7. Barrett
8. O'Connor
9. Newton
10. A.Farrell
11. Bateman
12. L.Farrell
13. O'Loughlin
14. Flower
15. Leuluai
16. Hock
17. Hoffman
I've gone for players overall time with us rather than just thinking about their peak - hence no Fielden or Roberts who were great at their peak for us but not in an average day. Special mentions to French, Dallas, Connolly and Williams who I'm sure others would have in.'"
When was Tomkins a scrum half for you?
Also Farrell was a back row. Those players are too good to shoehorn in out of position. Build the team around those two........
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| Faz won the golden boot playing prop.
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| Quote: Shabino "When was Tomkins a scrum half for you?
Also Farrell was a back row. Those players are too good to shoehorn in out of position. Build the team around those two........'"
Tomkins came through for us in the halves in a year he made the dream team, Wigan player of the year and Super League young player of the year. He played for England there too. Has he not played for Catalans there as well? Feel like he has. Obviously you would want him in the side, but Radlinski's defensive capabilities and safety under the high ball make him the better full back IMO even though Tomkins is the better player. Andy Farrell played some of his best rugby for us at prop, and we have a lot better back rowers to pick from than we do props.
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| I think Radlinski would struggle in today's game from an attacking standpoint. Plus Tomkins has barely played at 7 since Maguire moved him to fullback - what a coaching decision that was by the way for both the player and his clubs.
Re Flower/Smith - can't recall any Wigan prop having a better SL season than Craig Smith in 2003 so he would easily win that one for me.
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| Quote: MadDogg "I think Radlinski would struggle in today's game from an attacking standpoint. Plus Tomkins has barely played at 7 since Maguire moved him to fullback - what a coaching decision that was by the way for both the player and his clubs.
Re Flower/Smith - can't recall any Wigan prop having a better SL season than Craig Smith in 2003 so he would easily win that one for me.'"
O Connors stats for us were immense in SL, 4 dream team selections and was named team of the decade 96-06
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| Quote: MadDogg "I think Radlinski would struggle in today's game from an attacking standpoint. Plus Tomkins has barely played at 7 since Maguire moved him to fullback - what a coaching decision that was by the way for both the player and his clubs.
Re Flower/Smith - can't recall any Wigan prop having a better SL season than Craig Smith in 2003 so he would easily win that one for me.'"
I know there's a lot of teams who run with the FB as another half but support play will never disappear from the game. He was the league top try scorer in 01 mainly through backing up breaks. There are a ton of times every season where I wish we had a Radlinski popping up on the shoulder of the man who made the break to turn it into points. Don't forget that side has a third pivot at LF in Lockers, rather than an extra prop as most teams use now.
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| Quote: Grimmy "I know there's a lot of teams who run with the FB as another half but support play will never disappear from the game. He was the league top try scorer in 01 mainly through backing up breaks. There are a ton of times every season where I wish we had a Radlinski popping up on the shoulder of the man who made the break to turn it into points. Don't forget that side has a third pivot at LF in Lockers, rather than an extra prop as most teams use now.'"
I think Tomkins was as good a support player as he had crazy pace to get there and could read the game so well, was also a pivot had good defence perfect full back for me
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| As a fullback, Rads over Sam anyday.
I'm still not convinced when the ball goes in the air that Sam will take it, but I always thought Rads would. Similarly, if someone breaks then the one person I would want if my life depended on it as last man would be Rads.
I'm a bit stuck in my ways but I want my fullback to primarily be able to defend. It's like football nowadays where defenders and keepers are expected to be able to bring the ball out from the back and most of them can't catch/tackle.
A fullback as an extra pivot is a great weapon to have but if his defence is appalling (I don't think Sam's is it just isn't as good as Rads) then what's the point?
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| Quote: Egg Chasing "As a fullback, Rads over Sam anyday.
I'm still not convinced when the ball goes in the air that Sam will take it, but I always thought Rads would. Similarly, if someone breaks then the one person I would want if my life depended on it as last man would be Rads.
I'm a bit stuck in my ways but I want my fullback to primarily be able to defend. It's like football nowadays where defenders and keepers are expected to be able to bring the ball out from the back and most of them can't catch/tackle.
A fullback as an extra pivot is a great weapon to have but if his defence is appalling (I don't think Sam's is it just isn't as good as Rads) then what's the point?'"
Yup, I don't want to overstate Tomkins' weaknesses just to make my case for Radlinski, but IMO the bigger the game, the more suited it becomes to Radlinski's skills over Tomkins'. There is less room to dance around defenders, and the consequences of dropping a high ball or missing a 1 on 1 tackle become greater. Hence Rads has the 2002 challenge cup final performance to point to, but there isn't an equivalent final where Tomkins bamboozled the defences.
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| Quote: Grimmy "Yup, and IMO the bigger the game, the more suited it becomes to Radlinski's skills. Over Tomkins'. There is less room to dance around defenders, and the consequences of dropping a high ball or missing a 1 on 1 tackle become greater.'"
There weren't many big games in which Sam didn't shine TBH. He is just a class act and when I say his defence isn't as good as Radlinskis it is probably 8/10 to 9/10.
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| Quote: Grimmy "Yup, I don't want to overstate Tomkins' weaknesses just to make my case for Radlinski, but IMO the bigger the game, the more suited it becomes to Radlinski's skills over Tomkins'. There is less room to dance around defenders, and the consequences of dropping a high ball or missing a 1 on 1 tackle become greater. Hence Rads has the 2002 challenge cup final performance to point to, but there isn't an equivalent final where Tomkins bamboozled the defences.'"
with that then Hardaker should be FB instead of French
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| Quote: MadDogg "I think Radlinski would struggle in today's game from an attacking standpoint. Plus Tomkins has barely played at 7 since Maguire moved him to fullback - what a coaching decision that was by the way for both the player and his clubs.
Re Flower/Smith - can't recall any Wigan prop having a better SL season than Craig Smith in 2003 so he would easily win that one for me.'"
I can't agree re Radlinski....
Radlinski's point scoring stats are rather impressive, for someone so lacking in attacking attributes in your opinion.
He would have adapted his game easily as well, as he read the game brilliantly..... He was rather quick too...
I'm totally biased as i'm a massive fan, he is my favourite player. There may have been better players around, and many players there strong points, but just loved watching him be in the right place at the right time
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| Quote: Pieman "with that then Hardaker should be FB instead of French'"
Not really, Tomkins could play brilliantly in the halves. French can't (or hasn't shown that yet anyway). Radlinski was also a miles better attacker than Hardaker is today, but we're on a big tangent. I'm not saying I wouldn't pick Tomkins, obviously he's brilliant and you would want him in somewhere.
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| Quote: Grimmy "Not really, Tomkins could play brilliantly in the halves. French can't (or hasn't shown that yet anyway). Radlinski was also a miles better attacker than Hardaker is today, but we're on a big tangent. I'm not saying I wouldn't pick Tomkins, obviously he's brilliant and you would want him in somewhere.'"
but hardaker is a better defender and under the high ball, the only things Rads had over sam
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| Quote: Pieman "but hardaker is a better defender and under the high ball, the only things Rads had over sam'"
OK well I wouldn't pick Hardaker over French but fair enough if you would. I said I'd pick Radlinski and Tomkins, not Radlinski over Tomkins.
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