| FORUMS > Wigan Warriors > CONFIRMED - Tomkins to NZ Warriors |
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| Quote: DaveO "They have to come back first.
That will only happen if it suits both parties yet some give the impression it's a done deal and they will be back in Wigan colours in X years.
Maybe that is what they want to believe but its certainly not guaranteed and there is IMO an element of spin from IL when he announces these deals suggesting they will return is a certainty.
I was also under the impression we were only able to hold their registrations for a set period of time. I am sure when the Mossop deal was announced we only got first dibs if he came back after two or three years i.e. immediately after his contract with his Aussie club expires.'"
so what if he doesn't come back to superleague thats sam tomkins decision not anybody else's and if he does decided to come home and not retire over there he will becoming back to wigan, what more do you expect lenegan to do? |
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| Quote: Wigan Peer "So, in view of the fact that Sam has broken the terms of his contract, is it not a good thing that the management have taken decisive action, and sold a player who clearly does not wish to play for the club...'"
If Sam had broken the terms of his contract then no its not a good thing as it shows an so called watertight contract is worthless so they should have enforced his contract. That was after all its purpose (to keep him here for a minimum of three years). Once he had spoken to NRL clubs and came to the club with the news he should have been given short shrift and told to get back to training.
Him leaving represents a failure of management not a success because they got a fee.
My view is he won't have broken the terms of his deal but that he will have asked permission to speak to NRL clubs possibly at the behest of his agent. I think this is a reasonable view to take given the words IL used in the press release. I don't think Sam is the kind of person to go behind the clubs back as he seems a genuine bloke off the field and not some sneaky underhand type. If so the problem lies with IL who agreed to the request.
Either way as I said him leaving represents a failure of management. It's that simple. |
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| Quote: dubairl "so what if he doesn't come back to superleague thats sam tomkins decision not anybody else's and if he does decided to come home and not retire over there he will becoming back to wigan, what more do you expect lenegan to do?'"
Nothing!
I was pointing out he can't force them to return and that it would require them to want to return for Wigan to get first dibs on their services and there is no guarantee that they will.
I happen to think its unlikely they will return so this is really just more PR spin some are happy to swallow as our chairman being brilliant.
The NRL salary cap is set to increase year on year and unless the players get home sick or are failures I don't expect them to be back. They would be mugs to comeback here on vastly lower wages and they aren't mugs. |
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Sam will do very well in the NRL.
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Good luck Sam
And i see DaveO is still whining about him breaking his contract!
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The contract Sam signed will no doubt of been kosher and the clauses that were claimed to be in it were in it imo.
The 3 years of no talking to NRL/union clubs clause cant be enforced if we accept a bid for him before that term is up can it? That's what IL has done imo. Big bid has come in and he accepted it and gave Sam permission to talk to NZW.
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| Quote: DaveO "Nothing!
I was pointing out he can't force them to return and that it would require them to want to return for Wigan to get first dibs on their services and there is no guarantee that they will.
I happen to think its unlikely they will return so this is really just more PR spin some are happy to swallow as our chairman being brilliant.
The NRL salary cap is set to increase year on year and unless the players get home sick or are failures I don't expect them to be back. They would be mugs to comeback here on vastly lower wages and they aren't mugs.'"
fair enough i don't think thats what Lenegan wants people to believe tho, its a clause to say if he comes back in 3 years he has a contract at a set salary already, and if he doesn't we get first refusal anyway.
As some one who hasn't lived in their hometown for close to 8 years i can tell you, you get homesick no matter how big of a dump the uk is at the moment. |
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Just Id thought Id share my correspondence with the club with all boys and girls..
Owdpop.....
So IL has a few questions to answer....
1. Tomkins signed a 5year deal in Nov 2011 that stopped him SPEAKING to ANY club for 3 years. In Sept 2013 he has SIGNED for NZ Warriors. How and why has the happened??
2. Why have you announced this 4 days before the most important game if the year??
3. What do you propose to do with the reported £1M the club has made in transfer fees this year??
Wigan Warriors....
the first 2 can be answered from todays press conference;
1. Wigan accepted a world record transfer bid from NZ Warriors and gave the club permission to talk to the player.
2. Both deals were finalised last week, so it was right that the fans were informed before Sams last home game.
3. Remains to be seen
Owd Pop.......
1. This then shows the Wigan club to be very weak IMO. To have fans believe back in Nov 2011 that SAMs not going anywhere for at least 3 years and then to let him go after 20 months is taking the proverbials out of the paying fans.
2. So the club has now created the 'Sam is leaving circus' before Fridays game. When all the fans should be concentrating is on backing the side onto victory. I couldn't care less about waving good bye to a player that doesn't honour his commitments to my club.
3. Well it would be nice to know.
Wigan Warriors....
The transfer bid could have come at any time and it was up to the Club whether or not to accept it. Due to the figures suggested, the offer was obviously too good to turn down.
Read the link below for more details on the deal;
www.wiganwarriors.com/WContent.a ... 674&type=1
Thanks,
Admin
Owdpop...
I appreciate the replies I really do. The reasons you give for the sale leaves me extremely worried about my club and the sport in the UK. It seems any bid for our players that seem too good will now be accepted. This hardly leaves fans wanting to buy season tickets for next year does it. Why sell your prize asset when we still have a salary cap in place? It's not as if we can just go around splashing the cash is it?? The reason given by IL for the sale gave the perception that Sam was the main driver and he was desperate to leave, whilst your answer suggest otherwise. It's all rather sad for the fans of our once great club.
So IL was the main driving force behind the deal not Sam as he was the first port of call. It remain to be seen what happens with all that lovely money... |
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Just Id thought Id share my correspondence with the club with all boys and girls..
Owdpop.....
So IL has a few questions to answer....
1. Tomkins signed a 5year deal in Nov 2011 that stopped him SPEAKING to ANY club for 3 years. In Sept 2013 he has SIGNED for NZ Warriors. How and why has the happened??
2. Why have you announced this 4 days before the most important game if the year??
3. What do you propose to do with the reported £1M the club has made in transfer fees this year??
Wigan Warriors....
the first 2 can be answered from todays press conference;
1. Wigan accepted a world record transfer bid from NZ Warriors and gave the club permission to talk to the player.
2. Both deals were finalised last week, so it was right that the fans were informed before Sams last home game.
3. Remains to be seen
Owd Pop.......
1. This then shows the Wigan club to be very weak IMO. To have fans believe back in Nov 2011 that SAMs not going anywhere for at least 3 years and then to let him go after 20 months is taking the proverbials out of the paying fans.
2. So the club has now created the 'Sam is leaving circus' before Fridays game. When all the fans should be concentrating is on backing the side onto victory. I couldn't care less about waving good bye to a player that doesn't honour his commitments to my club.
3. Well it would be nice to know.
Wigan Warriors....
The transfer bid could have come at any time and it was up to the Club whether or not to accept it. Due to the figures suggested, the offer was obviously too good to turn down.
Read the link below for more details on the deal;
www.wiganwarriors.com/WContent.a ... 674&type=1
Thanks,
Admin
Owdpop...
I appreciate the replies I really do. The reasons you give for the sale leaves me extremely worried about my club and the sport in the UK. It seems any bid for our players that seem too good will now be accepted. This hardly leaves fans wanting to buy season tickets for next year does it. Why sell your prize asset when we still have a salary cap in place? It's not as if we can just go around splashing the cash is it?? The reason given by IL for the sale gave the perception that Sam was the main driver and he was desperate to leave, whilst your answer suggest otherwise. It's all rather sad for the fans of our once great club.
So IL was the main driving force behind the deal not Sam as he was the first port of call. It remain to be seen what happens with all that lovely money... | |
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| Quote: Wandering Warrior "The 3 years of no talking to NRL/union clubs clause cant be enforced if we accept a bid for him before that term is up can it? That's what IL has done imo. Big bid has come in and he accepted it and gave Sam permission to talk to NZW.'"
100% this |
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| Quote: Owdpopularsider "Just Id thought Id share my correspondence with the club with all boys and girls..
Owdpop.....
So IL has a few questions to answer....
1. Tomkins signed a 5year deal in Nov 2011 that stopped him SPEAKING to ANY club for 3 years. In Sept 2013 he has SIGNED for NZ Warriors. How and why has the happened??
2. Why have you announced this 4 days before the most important game if the year??
3. What do you propose to do with the reported £1M the club has made in transfer fees this year??
Wigan Warriors....
the first 2 can be answered from todays press conference;
1. Wigan accepted a world record transfer bid from NZ Warriors and gave the club permission to talk to the player.
2. Both deals were finalised last week, so it was right that the fans were informed before Sams last home game.
3. Remains to be seen
Owd Pop.......
1. This then shows the Wigan club to be very weak IMO. To have fans believe back in Nov 2011 that SAMs not going anywhere for at least 3 years and then to let him go after 20 months is taking the proverbials out of the paying fans.
2. So the club has now created the 'Sam is leaving circus' before Fridays game. When all the fans should be concentrating is on backing the side onto victory. I couldn't care less about waving good bye to a player that doesn't honour his commitments to my club.
3. Well it would be nice to know.
Wigan Warriors....
The transfer bid could have come at any time and it was up to the Club whether or not to accept it. Due to the figures suggested, the offer was obviously too good to turn down.
Read the link below for more details on the deal;
well from all the interviews sam has done its not mentioned he was pushed out at all completely the opposite and it seemed it was all ways on he's agenda to leave this year or the next. Shaun Wane said he tried to connivence sam to stays but sam wanted to leave.
I guess the club accepted that sam wouldn't stay with us for the rest of he's carer and they didn't want to stand in the way if they got appropriately compensated (which they have). Just out of curiosity why do you think the club would tell you its business plans for the following years?
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| Quote: Owdpopularsider "Just Id thought Id share my correspondence with the club with all boys and girls..
Owdpop.....
So IL has a few questions to answer....
1. Tomkins signed a 5year deal in Nov 2011 that stopped him SPEAKING to ANY club for 3 years. In Sept 2013 he has SIGNED for NZ Warriors. How and why has the happened??
2. Why have you announced this 4 days before the most important game if the year??
3. What do you propose to do with the reported £1M the club has made in transfer fees this year??
Wigan Warriors....
the first 2 can be answered from todays press conference;
1. Wigan accepted a world record transfer bid from NZ Warriors and gave the club permission to talk to the player.
2. Both deals were finalised last week, so it was right that the fans were informed before Sams last home game.
3. Remains to be seen
Owd Pop.......
1. This then shows the Wigan club to be very weak IMO. To have fans believe back in Nov 2011 that SAMs not going anywhere for at least 3 years and then to let him go after 20 months is taking the proverbials out of the paying fans.
2. So the club has now created the 'Sam is leaving circus' before Fridays game. When all the fans should be concentrating is on backing the side onto victory. I couldn't care less about waving good bye to a player that doesn't honour his commitments to my club.
3. Well it would be nice to know.
Wigan Warriors....
The transfer bid could have come at any time and it was up to the Club whether or not to accept it. Due to the figures suggested, the offer was obviously too good to turn down.
Read the link below for more details on the deal;
So the deal was initiated by WIGAN not Sam................?
Not what IL says in the official statement.
"When we realised that Sam was not able to be persuaded to stay a further year at Wigan - having won 2 Challenge Cups, 2 League Leaders Shields and 1 Grand Final, with the chance shortly of that being 2, together with Man-of-Steel and Junior Player of the Year Awards - we have had an open dialogue with him about New Zealand Warriors"
So which is it?
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| Quote: XBrettKennyX "So the deal was initiated by WIGAN not Sam................?
Not what IL says in the official statement.
"When we realised that Sam was not able to be persuaded to stay a further year at Wigan - having won 2 Challenge Cups, 2 League Leaders Shields and 1 Grand Final, with the chance shortly of that being 2, together with Man-of-Steel and Junior Player of the Year Awards - we have had an open dialogue with him about New Zealand Warriors"
So which is it?'"
MAYBE NZW made a bid and IL told Sam he was going to reject it, Sam then said he would want to go so IL accepted the offer??? |
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| Quote: [Gareth] ""MAYBE NZW made a bid and IL told Sam he was going to reject it, Sam then said he would want to go so IL accepted the offer???'"
Well at least one of these statments is wrong, or at the very least misleading! |
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Moderator
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| Quote: DaveO "They have to come back first.
That will only happen if it suits both parties yet some give the impression it's a done deal and they will be back in Wigan colours in X years.
Maybe that is what they want to believe but its certainly not guaranteed and there is IMO an element of spin from IL when he announces these deals suggesting they will return is a certainty.
I was also under the impression we were only able to hold their registrations for a set period of time. I am sure when the Mossop deal was announced we only got first dibs if he came back after two or three years i.e. immediately after his contract with his Aussie club expires.'"
I've no idea what you're point is Dave apart from writing another post bellyaching about Lenagan. The club clearly state that IF Tomkins comes back to SL we get first dibs at an agreed remuneration.
Anyone who believes IL suggests a "return is a certainly" is blinded even more by their current agenda than even I thought possible.
The context of my reply was in relation to the point these things aren't enforceable - when they clearly are as shown in our very sport, by our very own assistant coach. |
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| Quote: The_Enforcer "[iThe new contract, extended by a further 12 months, includes a clause which means that the England full-back cannot speak to either rugby union or ]Australian NRL clubs for three years. ][/i
I didn't even realise that the clause meant he couldn't speak to NRL clubs either. I thought it was just for RU clubs. This makes todays news even worse. We have lost the best player in Super League 2 years into a 5 year contract a year before he was supposed to even speak to an NRL club.'"
Just note it says Australian, not Australasian, clubs as although NZ Warriors play in the NRL, they are infact not Australian, but as their name would suggest from New Zealand (Sorry for the Geographical loop hole)
Sad loss to SL though that he is going to NRL, but would rather keep him in RL than him going to Yawnion! |
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