Amos was also out for an extended period which COULD have been a massive loss. The form he was in made him a very clear favourite for man of steel after the first few months of the season.

Even if you just had kyle eastmond in the middle of the field proppped up by a few crutches with a sling flicking his floppy broken leg back and forth to kick the ball you would have a better kicking game than ours.

Why are you ignoring the point I made ... namely that in the two convincing league victories we had over Leeds, McGuire was playing in the first and McGuire and Peacock were both playing in the second? It seems to me that you only want to talk about the last match because that's the one in which they weren't playing.

Also ... I didn't say that Eastmond and Pryce don't count. I was talking about Leeds, not Saints. The only reference I made to Eastmond in this thread was that maybe you lot had better get used to being without him, as we have had to get used to being without Roberts, because neither Eastmond or Roberts ever seem to be available.

Field position and kicking will be key. Wigan need to starve Saints of the ball, especially when Cunningham is on. Deacon needs to use his head, kick early to Meli, turn their big lads around, while they are still getting onside, Foster/Gidley/Wellens etc will have taken another scoot or two. It's too late in the set for Graham and the big lads to get a roll on and Cunningham to take them down field. I fancy Wigan to win it, just because of the difference in the halves and backs.

It'll be a very interesting game.

Richards > Foster

There's the answer.

Because your point is a nonsense. You seem to be saying that because you have beaten Leeds in a domestic league game without these players, that therefore McGuire and Peacock would make little impact in a major knock out game ? I seriously dont see what you are trying to suggest. Leeds have proven themselves as the best on the big occasion for the past few years and in particular both McGuire and Peacock. Peacock is a huge metre maker and McGuire a big scorer and assists in many as well. Your point does not stand up. Simply because they played when Wigan beat Leeds in a meaningless league game does not mean that they are both not massive parts of Leeds ability to win the big game and that their losses did not impact on their ability to get consistent results.



The whole point I made was that Wigan have topped the table in massive part because Leeds and St Helens have had big disruptions with injuries this season. Since Saints finished closest to Wigan I would suggest that discussing the injuries Saints have suffered is an enormous part of that point. .

With regards to Eastmond Im actually inclined to agree. He is a player who you invariably hold your breath whenever he goes into contact.

no point trying, you won't win

I see. So the Wigan/Leeds matches that Wigan won were 'meaningless' (even though they were league games staged when both sides still had it all to play for)? In other words, they were non-competitive and Leeds weren't trying very hard, despite them having their best players on the field? And this is the explanation why Wigan won? And why, if these guys had been playing in the knock-out game, Leeds would have won.

And that's the evidence with which you back up your assertion?

Do guys like you ever stop to wonder what you actually sound like?

The Saints pack looks stronger than Wigan's IMO, with Soliola/Wilkin/Emmitt added to the pack that has contested the other 2 games this season. Wilkin and Soliola offer us a lot in defence.

Lack of a running game in the halves might cost us IMO - I'm hoping Lomax lines up at 6.

I love the damsel in distress routine. You have now completely changed your argument as you simply have nothing to back it up with. When I state 'meaningless' it needs to be placed in context. Yes it is for the 2 points in the league but I think we all know that in knock out games, the best sides do raise their game, Leeds in particular. I never once stated they were 'non-competitive' and nor that Leeds would have won the knock out game either. My point is a very valid one and any sensible individual can see that. Leeds raise for big games and McGuire and Peacock are both huge parts of that. No way would they have [idefinitely[/i beaten Wigan with those two but they would certainly have stood a better chance.



Evidence to back up what assertion, that Leeds would have had a better chance of defeating Wigan had McGuire and Peacock not been injured. Honestly here Cruncher, I'd say that its pretty much common sense. I have watched Saints beat Leeds consistently in the league rounds and in qualifying Play Offs and I have then watched the same Leeds side beat us when it counts. Its pretty straight forward and I fail to see why you wish to make a big issue out of it.

Amos Roberts was the best player in the league before he got injured, if we had him playing at full fitness we could of won by more. Its all hypothetical though just like your point. We beat Leeds when it mattered and now we are in the final. You can say all the ifs and buts in the world but when it comes down to it its the result matters and nothing else.

thing is you can only beat whats in front of you
whos to say if peacock and mcguir had been playin our lads wouldnt of picked it up even more you cant just guess possible outcomes
as first said you can only beat whats in front of you

Can't you do better than that?

Presumably this is supposed to provoke me in some way. Not quite sure how or why, but similar silliness from Leeds fans didn't work last week, and it won't from you this week.



Spin it any way you want. The fact remains that you dismissed Wigan's two league victories over Leeds as meaningless, preferrring to talk about the play-off victory, because that's the oen in which McGuire and Peacock were not playing. In other words, that's the one thats suits your argument.

And common sense, or not, you haven't got a crystal ball, mate ... so you don't know whether it would have made any difference if McGuire and Peacock were playing, any more than you know whether it would have made any difference had we fielded Amos Roberts in the sort of form he showed early season. It's all a bit pointless.

But hey ... just so that I can't be accused of making a big deal out of it, I'll let it drop there. I've made my point, and you've made yours. I'm right, and I'm content with that knowledge. So the conversation's over.

I have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. You seem to have taken some issue with a point I have made and I have no idea why.



I have spoken very little about the Play Off game between Leeds and Wigan. I have also clearly stated that had McGuire and Peacock played then that in no way would have guaranteed a Leeds victory. I also find it absurdly arrogant and rude of you to state that your opinion is 'right'. Opinions are precisely as they are, opinions. Why you seem to have taken an issue with a simple point on a website is anybodies guess. I agree that this conversation is going nowhere and frankly I would rather not debate with such immaturity so I will no longer respond.

Good luck for Saturday.

Do you not think having both our halfbacks out for most of the last 6 weeks has anything to do with us only scoring a yard out?

We are missing our halfbacks which means we just grind out wins and have to take our chances when we get on your try line, it's a case of win by playing to our strngth.

If i was to coach against saints, i'd kick and pin us down in our own half as we ain't got the players to score from in our half. I'd tell my players not give any pens away so we can't piggy back down the field from cheap pens.

Also, you have to target meli. If he's on the wing kick to him, if he's in the centre then attack his side.

Watch roby running from acting half.

In the main i think if you kick and pin us in our own half, you will win pretty easy imo.