FORUMS > Wigan Warriors > SAM, 1 OR 6 |
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| i mentioned earlier last week that we shouldn't have played sam at FB and although none of the tries conceded against wire were down to him alone, all i will say is i told you so
wire are too big a team to have a scrawny kid at FB. should have had roberts there from the off if you ask me for a game like that.
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| It's a hard one to call. I was initially happy to see Sam at 1 because he can come into the attacking line from deep and cause some serious trouble for the opposing side in defence and this happened a lot last season. This season however he has been less effective (perhaps teams are more aware of his threat or his link up plays are too similar so can be easily thwarted) & what's worse is Sam has to come in and play first or second receiver for some of the plays because our kicking game in the halves is shockingly poor.
I would move Sam to 6 next week and bring Amos in at 1 if Deacon is still missing with Finch in at 7 and move Leuluai to 9 interchanging with McIlorum
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| Quote: Grimmy "Deacon seems to get injured every time he takes to the pitch though, he really came up short in the WCC too, looked right out of ideas and has no pace either. He did a good job at the end of last year but his best days are behind him now and he's in danger of doing himself a serious injury. He needs to be used as back-up now if at all. Out of interest does anyone know what would happen if Deacs now retired from playing and moved to the coaching staff as originally planned? Would we save anything with regard to the cap?'"
With Deacon at 7 on the downside of his career it allows a younger player to fill in, in preparation for the position. Bleed in Mellor or Powell throughout the back end of the season with aim to them being a natural replacement.
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| Quote: - Neil - "1 for me as in my eyes is playing 6 at the moment he just defends at full back out of the way.
The game has evolved now the job description of each position is slightly different, dont be fooled by the number on his back.
Your full back is / can be your 6. This is the role Sam plays he just defends at full back which is a good thing as he cannot be targetted in the line.
Just because of one bad performance we do not need to make wholesale changes. We need Pat, Fielden, Joel and Farrell back and Finch needs some to gametime to gel with the team.'"
Exactly. Look at the top FB's in RL. The description would be speed to burn, save under the high ball but more importantly can link up in the attacking line as a first/second or even third reciever.
Watch thre NRL, people need to take note on how the likes of
Slater
Hayne
Gidley
Weisser
etc
play.
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Last league derby at Knowsley Road 2/4/2010: St. Helens 10 Wigan 18:26.jpg |
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| I just do not get this "if he plays at 6 he will get targeted so he has to play at 1". What do people think happened to Shaun Edwards when he played 6?
Edwards was also the most hated player in England (as someone said Sam is earlier in the thread). So what if Sam is? He needs to deal with it and his team mates need to do so as well.
Do Wire play Briers at 1 because every other team hates him (which they do)? Burrow at Leeds is probably the smallest player in the league so he ought to be at 1 following this logic.
For me Sam has got to play 6. At 1 he seems to have been worked out. He is not IMO playing as a 6 with a 1 on his back. He comes into the line often from quite deep and rarely passes the ball. He appears to be the one who is supposed to be taking the final pass in a move and if he doesn't score then that's the end of that. Stand off's don't play like that and do not attempt to take on the line at every play which is what Sam seems to be doing most of the time.
Also given the players we have then Tommy at 9 interchanging with Micky Mac gives us variation there and options so do that and play Finch at 7, Sam at 6 and Roberts at 1 and we have a very potent attack.
This is before we even think of the defensive aspects of playing full back. Sam is not tall enough or big enough IMO to fulfil the defensive obligations of a top full back.
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| Quote: Grimmy "Deacon seems to get injured every time he takes to the pitch though, he really came up short in the WCC too, looked right out of ideas and has no pace either. He did a good job at the end of last year but his best days are behind him now and he's in danger of doing himself a serious injury. He needs to be used as back-up now if at all. Out of interest does anyone know what would happen if Deacs now retired from playing and moved to the coaching staff as originally planned? Would we save anything with regard to the cap?'"
Get him recovered from his current injury and get a headguard on him I say. He will be useful to us again this year, as last, if we can get him on the field. Didn't Deacs wear a headguard in his early Bradford days? I'm sure he did.
I'm really undecided about Sam. He's a threat in either position but I'd say the calls for him to play at 6 are because our attacking options are being read far too easily. At the moment he's being snuffed out at 1.
I also lament when we go to the air almost every time we're close to the opposition line. I know this creates an opportunity to challenge for the ball and it is a "contest" but a variation in attacking kicks would be to our benefit. A little grubber to force a repeat set never hurt anybody. Kudos to Finch for seemingly aiming for the post and it resulting in a try on debut.
And breathe
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| Targetted more at 6? He didn't exactly suffer before when defending at 6. Infact, he did quite the opposite. He was particularly good at defending from the marker position. Plus, it was very rare he'd be relied on to take a high ball or make a 1 on 1 last ditch tackle as there was always someone to back up in the tackle.
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| For the reason why Sam should be 6 and Amos should be 1, see HJ game 2010
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| Absolutely, Sam should be at 6. He is far more effective when he's in the line and creating things in the halves than he is at FB.
Get him to 6 ASAP.
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| Quote: DaveO "I just do not get this "if he plays at 6 he will get targeted so he has to play at 1". What do people think happened to Shaun Edwards when he played 6?
Edwards was also the most hated player in England (as someone said Sam is earlier in the thread). So what if Sam is? He needs to deal with it and his team mates need to do so as well.
Do Wire play Briers at 1 because every other team hates him (which they do)? Burrow at Leeds is probably the smallest player in the league so he ought to be at 1 following this logic.
For me Sam has got to play 6. At 1 he seems to have been worked out. He is not IMO playing as a 6 with a 1 on his back. He comes into the line often from quite deep and rarely passes the ball. He appears to be the one who is supposed to be taking the final pass in a move and if he doesn't score then that's the end of that. Stand off's don't play like that and do not attempt to take on the line at every play which is what Sam seems to be doing most of the time.
Also given the players we have then Tommy at 9 interchanging with Micky Mac gives us variation there and options so do that and play Finch at 7, Sam at 6 and Roberts at 1 and we have a very potent attack.
This is before we even think of the defensive aspects of playing full back. Sam is not tall enough or big enough IMO to fulfil the defensive obligations of a top full back.'"
Should of read this before I posted, absolutely 100% spot on DaveO
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| Quote: Yed™ "For the reason why Sam should be 6 and Amos should be 1, see HJ game 2010'"
Totally agree in the long term but Amos needs to get his confidence back first. Think we need to give him up to a maximum of half a dozen games on the wing and then we can hopefully make that switch.
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| Quote: Yed™ "For the reason why Sam should be 6 and Amos should be 1, see HJ game 2010'"
On paper yes, but since Amos wrapped his knee around the goalpost last year against Wakey he's not looked close to rediscovering that form. For evidence of that, see our game against Huddersfield two weeks ago
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| Quote: DaveO "I just do not get this "if he plays at 6 he will get targeted so he has to play at 1". What do people think happened to Shaun Edwards when he played 6?
Edwards was also the most hated player in England (as someone said Sam is earlier in the thread). So what if Sam is? He needs to deal with it and his team mates need to do so as well.
Do Wire play Briers at 1 because every other team hates him (which they do)? Burrow at Leeds is probably the smallest player in the league so he ought to be at 1 following this logic.
For me Sam has got to play 6. At 1 he seems to have been worked out. He is not IMO playing as a 6 with a 1 on his back. He comes into the line often from quite deep and rarely passes the ball. He appears to be the one who is supposed to be taking the final pass in a move and if he doesn't score then that's the end of that. Stand off's don't play like that and do not attempt to take on the line at every play which is what Sam seems to be doing most of the time.
Also given the players we have then Tommy at 9 interchanging with Micky Mac gives us variation there and options so do that and play Finch at 7, Sam at 6 and Roberts at 1 and we have a very potent attack.
This is before we even think of the defensive aspects of playing full back. Sam is not tall enough or big enough IMO to fulfil the defensive obligations of a top full back.'"
Spot on.
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