Yes because I am sure Wane knows no set moves and we have done none in training. On Sunday it couldnt possibly be anything to do with the team playing poorly and not executing them properly.

I really cant believe the over the top reaction on these boards since Sunday, after just one game. Some of the criticism of Shaun Wane and certain players has been beyond a joke and with some posters there seems to be a much more personal element to it than just straightforward criticism.

over the top? They looked slow, unfit and unwilling, its nothing personal just fact. If it was personal my season ticket wouldnt have been renewed. Take you head out of the clouds and think about the game and execution.

Some people on here need to learn how to debate.

There is far too much

"Some posters have it in for XXX"

"Some posters will say anything that makes YYY look bad"

"Some posters dare to criticise the current set up"

NO.

Some posters have views and refuse to follow the happy clappy crowd.

Nothing to do with my head in the clouds.I just think its pathetic how people are slating Wane after one game and trying to make out we were never that poor under Maguire when we plainly were. Indeed there were a few games last year when we were awful and as bad, if not worse, than we was on Sunday.

If you think we were slow, unfit and unwilling that then why heap all the blame on Wane's door? Isnt Bitcon the conditioner so why arent you slating him if you think they are slow and unfit? If players are unwilling and complacent then surely that is the players fault? The criticism and accusations that are flying around after 1 game is ridiculous and paints many Wigan fans in a bad light imo, particulalry when they spout nonsense like Wane needs to learn a set move and accuse him of saying and doing things that he hasnt even done. Wane has served his apprenticeship and deserves his chance which should surely consist of more than being hung to dry after one game. It is simply far too early to judge him. If we are playing like that in week 10 then all means give it to him with both barrells but I am sure we wont be.

Bitcon works for Wane. I didnt see us play as bad last year...name the game for me and I may reconsider. How can you blame the player for being unfit and conditioned, if they have done what they have been told pre season, if not why are they playing? If they have been told what to do then it isnt there fault. Have you ever played the game? Again I didnt say Wane deserves the sack or didnt deserve the shot, but look at Madges first game and compare the difference...a coach can only be judged on his last game so lets do that as we cant do anything else.

I wondered how long it would be before that phrase turned up again, but even I didn't think it would reappear after one defeat.

By 'happy clappers' you of course mean posters whose views differ with yours (even though in the same breath you're preaching to us all that everyone is entitled to hold their own view )

But I'd be wary of using it too much. Remember how things turned out for the Happy Clappers when they supported IL against people like you for his decision to drop Noble and then appoint Maguire.

I think it was clear to see that whatever they had been doing in the off season did not work. Before the game Wane stated they were ready. I dont see any problem in questioning why we saw a lousy performance since we were led to believe other things in the build up from Wane himself. You cant promise gold then deliver bronze and expect everybody to just overlook it in the hope he might deliver gold next week.....

If you were genuinely expecting victory every single week, then I'd agree. But though I don't hold with this 'early season doesn't matter' viewpoint, I still think you need to give him a bit more time. However, each to their own.

It has ceased to amaze me, just how knee jerk some people on here can be.

Your lack of faith and total negativity should ban you all from celebrating any success we may have during Wanes term as head coach.

I genuinly mean that

Catalan at home, and away for that matter, are 2 that immediately spring to mind. There were other games such as against Castleford were we werent too hot either and when there was plenty of criticism on these boards.

I haven't blamed any player for being unfit, try reading what is wrote. You said about players being slow and unfit and I said why are you laying all the blame on Wane when Bitcon is the conditioner. Bitcon is the expert and as such Wane will delegate to Bitcon when it comes to conditioning or do you really think that Wane tells Bitcon what to do and how to do his job. If that is the case Bitcon may as well go home. Wane may have some input saying he wants x, y and z from the players but Bitcon is the one who would decide if this is achievable and if so how they would go about achieving it. This is a professional sports club not St Pats u12s were the coach does it all. You accused players of being unwilling but blame the coach for this. If a player does not show desire, commitment and motivation then I will certainly blame the player, not the coach. For your information, seeing as you are so interested, yes I have played the game, as well as coached for that matter, thanks for asking.

Catalans were very good against us and had virtually full strength teams too (not 8 missing), at the end of the year they were the leagues form team so a bit off par would have seen us dicked. So like I said how long has Wane had the job and been in training? IF he cannot judge the fitness levels until the first game then he hasnt used the pre season as it should have been used. He should have used it to asses the fitness and plays he has given them. Have we played a full strength team in the pre season to get the fitness levels of plays right? Is that the players or Bitcons fault?

Are you then blaming Bitcon for it? As you have passed the blame from now the players to the conditioner who is overseen from the head coach.

Then again, if you had played and coached like you said you would have know what I have just said known the coach has the full accountability.

No, but they're a good indicator of how ridiculous you think the previous post was.

The same thoughts as before the Hudds game. We'll be there or there abouts at the end of the season and as Leeds proved last season, anything can happen. We've lost one game FFS!!

We were dicked, as you so eloquently put it, by Catalan at home and were awful. Do you not think we were awful? Catalan also had people out. There were many matches last year were these boards were full of criticism of the team and Maguire. With your previous couple of replies I seriously think you struggle to grasp simple English and I dont know why why are trying to say things that I havent. You also obsessed with if I have played the game or not like you are some sort of expert, which you are plainly not, and i have to say your condescending attitude is more than a little pathetic too.

I am not blaming anyone for anything as I do not go into a mass panic after one game of the season. I have never blamed the players for their condition either which you have accused me of again even though I corrected you in my last post. You obviously do not grasp English too well. It is people like you blaming Wane for one thing after another, not me. I am simply saying that I fail to see how if you feel they are unfit then dont you think that instead of the very simplistic blame the coach routine that you should be aiming your flack at the conditioner, it isnt exactly rocket science. If You accuse players of being unwilling then why not blame the players? It was not Wane who dropped balls, fluffed moves, missed easy tackles, had an awful kicking game etc. Likewise we have played no less friendly matches with a full strength team than previous seasons. Reading the reactions on here you would have thought we would have lost our first game by 60 points.