Its relevant.

Sam Tomkins has not matched Danny McGuire's achievements in the game, nor is he likely to.

It is not relevant at all to the question of who is the better player.

If you were correct then it would mean that Shaun Edwards was a far better player than Ellery Hanley.

He will - easily, if he gets the time.

At least, that's what my crystal ball says.

Is mine more accurate than yours?

As already pointed out, team trophies mean little towards personal stats. Good players win nothing in a poor team, and poor players can pick up medals in a good one.

More relevant is that McGuire had ZERO international selections when he was Sam's age, and only got 19 in total. Sam has 8 already.

In which position do you see him getting his 9th Geoff?

danny is about 28 if i'm right and facing more of a fight these days for any furthe rinternational recognition. sam is what, 21 /22?

the rate sam is going, he will probably earn more achievements whether with wigan, whoever else and internationally than half the leeds team put together, in his playing career.

The more astute point out it's two games less. His 1 game ban and the game behind we are already.

the thing with sam is that he does annoy people but he has to stick up for himself when u get the dirty players such as from leeds (bailey, ablett and cross) targettting him all the time and then wen he goes to take the kick ur all chanting sam tomkins is a w***er obviously hes gonna get annoyed and angry wat do u expect

Don't worry about it. They just wish he played for them.

In your own post you say way it is irrelevant. You do this by using the word "achievements" An achievement is irrelevant. Briers is easily as good a player as Long is or ever was but because he plays for Wire not Saints he hasnt achieved as much. Riddell is easily better than Cunningham but due to the teams hes played for he hasn't achieved as much medal count wise as Cunningham has.

Are you understanding the point yet? Hows this one? Do you SERIOUSLY believe that Mathers is better than Hodgson just because Mathers has 2 cup winners medals and Hodgson has no medals (other than a Grand Final losers medal from the NRL).

You see the flaws in the achievement vs ability argument yet or do you need even more?

Tomkins is a very good player with a bright future ahead of him but think he's got a long way to go before you can compare him to someone like Danny Mcguire. Mcguire has proved it over a long period of time and has won massive games for Leeds with flashes of brilliance In every season he has played,

Tomkins will need to do it over a longer period before you will have a serious argument, I think he will but who knows what might happen in the coming seasons, yes he has talent and looks good but has to stand the test of time before he can be mentioned in the same breath.

Spot on!

Actions speak louder than words.

Thats fine with us if your happy with Danny McGuire instead of Sam Tomkins, we are happy with Sam Tomkins instead of Danny McGuire. Everyone is happy

McGuire has won 4 league titles, 0 challenge cups and 2 WCC.

Tomkins already has 1 league title and has won YPOTY 2 years on the trot. As an individual honour that is a pretty high one. I don't think that success is down to just McGuire as well, it is the whole Leeds team. Tomkins is the better player, I can't believe anyone would disagree.

Mate I can't believe you actually believe Riddell is better than Cunningham, that has to be one of the worst statements I've ever heard. I bet you can't find a rugby fan in world rugby that would agree with you. I'm actually really shocked you've said that.