I think this is true. I think its a clean slate for the lot of them and that includes two who I think consistently under-performed, Riddle and Roberts.

Should they have done better than the less experienced players? Yes in my opinion but it's water under the bridge now. The same should apply to Goulding etc.

I don't think there should be any player under any more pressure to deliver than any other player including those two along with Hansen, J Tomkins and Goulding. They all have to respond to the new regime, fit in with it and train and play as instructed.

If come the end of next season having all started with a clean slate some players are not delivering or responding to the new regime then we can debate then if they need to go but the key point is no one should be under any more pressure then anyone else to perform.

Put it this way, if they didn't perform under Noble and don't perform under MM then it's most likely the player that isn't good enough not the coaching. I am optimistic enough to believe the vast majority of them will perform better under MM.

Dave

I think it's totally correct that it should and will be a clean slate for everybody. Thats really exciting isn't it because it means that all the teams people are picking could be way wrong come the start of the season.

Who's to say at the start of the year Pryce, Ainscough, Mossop etc won't be first team regulars. If they(and others) get their heads down and impress the new man in pre season there is no reason why he won't pick them as starters. He has no loyalty to anybody in this squad which should ensure everybody is fully commited going into the season.

It's a really exciting time at the moment.

Absolutely and yes, the players i mentioned earlier arent on their own but remember (former manager) Mr Noble was not a major fan of Hansen hence the reason H was constantly unhappy at being on the bench every week, and he admittedly got a break of fortune when Gaz Hock got banned and mibbe Joel did too but i repeat.. his place has still got to be won in the side as has Joel who always flatters to decieve for me and i have watched him since his debut (no matter how many fans he has on these boards) as have Darryl and Feka too..

On the Mossop front id say very possibly yes, he's the same, remember he was shipped out to Huddersfield on loan for a reason being that was either Noble wasnt a fan of him and thought there was better to come through or he needed first team regularity! whatever we believe and i did think he was superb in our last 8 to 10 games by the way.
Its going to be interesting how Mr Mcguire dictates as to who his mainstays are going to be but id be willing to bet a shilling that 2 or atleast 1 of the aforementioned players will be getting the toe.
Remember, weve all have our opinions and thats mine

Bob on......

Having just watched the Deacs video I will be interested in the squad numbers for next season....

Very!

It's going to be a good indication of how things are shaping up. Maybe the delay in the new shirts coming out is to give McGuire as much time as he needs before christmas with the squad to decide who should get which numbers.

People are going to want the names and numbers on the backs of their shirts so they have to be released before they go on sale.

From a neutral :

Phelps
Roberts
Gleeson
Carmont
Richards
S. Tomkins
Leuluai

Coley
Riddell
Prescott
J. Tomkins
Bailey / Hansen
O'Loughlin

McIlorum
Hansen / Mossop
Fielden
Palea'aesina

Mossop to get the number 11 shirt for me. He needs first team football week in week out, he has sooo much potential. We've got a gem there

I'd go with

Phelps
Roberts
Gleeson
Carmont
Richards
S. Tomkins
Leuluai
Coley
Riddell
Prescott
J. Tomkins
Hansen
O'Loughlin

Fielden
Feka
McIlorum
Bailey/Mossop

Phelps (needs to sure up his defence if he wants to keep his place(attack brilliant

Roberts - hopefully he'll be more settled this year, looks like a dangerous player when he wants to be, hopes he gets more involved this season

Glees - Class act, hopefully will be even better with a full Wigan Preseason until his belt (would like to see him given the ball with more space)

Carmont - Another class act, hopefully hes had time to sort them nagging injuries out (hope he plays the required amount of games for a further contract)

Pat (k) - Just keep kicking the goals and scoring the tries

Sam - Hope people are too expectant of him, doubt hes gunna be MOS (although I'd love it ) but hes just gotta keep working on his game and performing, would like to see him take more responibility in the kicking game.

Tommy - 7/9/7/9/7/9 Doesnt matter where hes playing hes a game breaker, give him half a game and hes stepped through. Hope he builds on his partnership with young sam and improves his long kicking game.

Coley - Keep up the good work from last year.

Riddell -Must improve on last year tbh, must lead us around the park better

Prescott -Hugely impressed with the rate of improvement in prescott last year when given his chance to start, hope it continues.

Hansen - Very underrated, gets through shed loads of work in defence, needs to put his hand up to take the ball up more though.

Bailey - Again underated IMO, think him and lockers will be the key to our defence structure next season when he regains fitness. Got a got positional sence in defence and can throw a good pass in attack, also dont have a problem with him fillin in at centre tbh

Lockers (c) - Awesome

Macca - Needs to make better decisions at times but a very good talent, seems to play with alot of passion

Feka - Improve his fitness and we know how good he can be.

Fielden - If Wane can find the old passion of Fielden thats inside him(like his performaces at the back end of 08 when he was really fighting for a world cup place), we could be looking at a good prop forward again (not fielden of old though)

Mossop - Outstanding talent IMO it was obviously sam who got everybody talking, but Mossop I thought was outstanding when given the chance last year, Runs in strong in attack and is burtal in defence, superleague look out

Joel, Ainscough, Deacon, Goulding, Pyrce, O'carrol, Farrell, Davies

Alot of depth in this squad.

1) Phelps
2) Ainscough
3) Gleeson
4) Carmont
5) Richards
6) S Tomkins
7) Deacon
Fielden
9) Leuluai
10) Prescott
11) J Tomkins
12) Hansen
13) O'Loughlin (c)

14) McIllorum
15) Coley
16) Feka
17) Mossop

1icon_cool.gif Roberts
19) Bailey
20) Riddell
21) Goulding
22) Pryce
23) O'Carroll

It's tough because I don't know the type of rugby McGuire plays and what players will suit it. But if i had to pick a best 13 it would be1.Phelps-Solid, just hope he improves his catching and defence over pre-season and he could be great.
2.Roberts- Yes, he has his silly moments, but he could do exactly the same as Pat did, Pat wasn't great first year but look at him now. Hope Amos goes same way.
3.Gleeson- impressed last year, hope he carries on. Wouldn't mind him getting more of the ball in attack.
4.Carmont- simply, he's an experienced player that helps out the younger ones. Plus the fact he's solid and finds a way to the tryline is a bonus.
5.Richards- Pat is Pat, strong in every department, if he improves his goal kicking and puts few more over, we could move up the table.
6.Tomkins- Like Pat, another important player to us, hope he carries on from last year.
7.Deacon- Glad we signed him, although Tommy is a decent half back, at times seemed lacking in creativity, whereas Deacon,with Sam, can take us to the next level. Quality player when he wants to play.
8.Prescott- Last year, was a close second to Sam for young player of year. Proved that he can hack it at the top level and looks a bright future if we keep hold of the likes of him and Mossop.
9.Leuluai- If we put Tommy here, he is a totally different player to the one playing at 7. Has shown he can play here in the World Cup and 4 Nations this year, hopefully he can do this for us.
10.Coley- Mr reliable from last year, and shown he can lead from the front. Deserved to stayy and hope he can continue next year.
11.Mossop- Young but proved at the the tail end of last year (Saints away in the league), that he is a quality of a player. Strong in both attack and defence and even gets the approval of my grandad, which not many forwards do.
12.Hansen- It was between him and Joel Tomkins for this place and I think he tips it because he gives us more in both attack and defence, this shown when Harrison was top tackler two years ago. Would rotate him and Tomkins throughout next year.
13.O'Loughlin- Captain and proved why last year with too many brilliant performances, and if he would have stayed fit throughout last year, would have run close to MOS. Keep leading us from the front Skipper!

Subs
Feka- Massive Impact Player.
Fielden- Hopefully becomes a new player next year with a new coach.
McIllorum- Shown last year what a great hooker he can be, with the help of Tommy, could become a great player.
Bailey- Put Bailey in because of 3 things- experience, ability and his leadership he can bring. Great in defence and was missed in the play offs and the rest of the semi-final against Wire. Can play in the forwards or in centre and this could be useful for us.

God, that was too long, pretty useless post but wanted my opinion across

Bailey will be in the first 13.

Phelps,
Roberts, Gleeson, Carmont, Richards,
S Tomkins, Leuluai,
Fielden, Riddell, Coley,
Hansen, Bailey,
O'Loughlin.

Prescott, Feka, J Tomkins, Deacon,
Goulding, Pryce, O'Carroll, McIlorum,
Mossop, Ainscough, Farrell, Mellor.

I don't think the first 13 will be changed around much but the 14-25 will be the interesting bit. Deacon will be used from the bench I'm sure during the early part of the season interchanging with Sam & Tommy.
Also under the SC which covers the highest paid 25 players we have 23 with first team rugby, just two who have not.
That seems a very deep and experienced squad for next year.

Some really tough choices to make for next season, personally:

1. Phelps
2. Robers
3. Gleeson
4. Carmont
5. Richards
6. S Tomkins
7. Deacon
8. Fielden
9. Riddell
10. Prescott
11. Hansen
12. Bailey
13. O'Loughlin

14. Leuluai
15. Coley
16. J. Tomkins
17. Feka

I'd also completely eliminate the 20 minute by the clock interchanges, and interchange when needed.

The biggest difficulty for me is trying to find game time for: McIlorum, Goulding, Pryce, Ainscough, Mossop, O'Carroll as they all need it. Players like Farrell, Thornley etc I think the odd SL game next season is sufficient but the aforementioned all I feel need more extensive game time and are far too developed already for the U20's and i'm not sure how many overage pllayers are allowed anyway.

Pryce is 23 (24 in July), O'Carroll is 22 (23 in June), Ainscough is 20, Goulding is 21 (22 in March), McIlorum is 21 (22 in January), Mossop is 20 (21 in January) they're all at the ages where they need some significant game time.