That's changed recently. 2 of the last 3 cup final winners have gone on to win the Grand Final.

I agree and that's part of the problem as well, Tomkins's best year was 2012, in that team he had Charnley Goulding Carmont Richards Finch and Leuluai around him, compare that to our team now and you'll see a lot of the problem, no one in our backs apart from Williams looks dangerous when he gets the ball so it's easy to target Sam because he's the only other possible threat, where as a few years ago you had Leuluai Finch Goulding Carmont Richards etc who looked dangerous on the ball

Leeds may have on the GF, but they lost the 3 games after the cup final, if we both do that we wont finish top of the league.

Will certainly effect both teams and it's up to Wigan to take advantage and get a home semi, which will be key.

sack Wane ? hes a great coach , wigan never thrown in the towel and are certainly the toughest team to beat week in week out, they are just poor in attack like most SL slubs , you cant win every year.

Fair enough getting beat 62-0 by Wakefield was understandable given the circumstances, but this year we definitely 'threw the towel in' against Brisbane (42-12) and Warrington away (40-10), last year we did against Castleford (42-14) and Catalans (58-16) away.


We defend well but no way are we consistently the toughest to beat. This stat is quite telling
We aren't just as poor in attack as most SL clubs though, they have all scored more points than us this year except one.


We certainly don't! Surely 4 out of 5 seasons ending in neither the CC nor the GF isn't enough.

People keep saying we have a great squad... but do we, really? I don't see that our squad (on paper, putting form and tactics to one side for the moment) is better than, say, FC's.

You FC fans who are bigging us up: how many of your first team would you swap for the equivalent Wiganer? Not too many, I suspect.

Yes, Geoff, I agree with that too. Let's say a deep squad, rather than a great one.

It's an interesting argument as to which is better. Having great players is...errrr....great, but in these salary cap days that means having below average players around them, and means over-reliance on the "greats" staying healthy. Leeds and Huddersfield would love to be as "average" as us right now, I suspect.

I know mate, it was tongue in cheek really, well 50/50. I feel we have an average squad with a good defensive coach who has proven over 18 months that he can't improve our attack, it's getting g worse if anyrhing, which makes him very average if you even it out, which reflects perfectly in our points difference.

Build yourself a cushion before wembley so that you can absorb a hangover and still finish top, like leeds did last year. You have to think bigger than just a CC win. This is a huge chance to rack up some trophies for hull this season.

I don't think your ability to deal with injuries better is totally down to being a more 'even' squad
The structure that Wane plays seems to be drilled into the whole squad, so injuries shouldn't be too disruptive

btw, if you think it is bad watching an over structured team, try watching a team with no structure (or game plan) whatsoever!

Say what you will about Wane, but if he were in charge of Leeds they would probably be close to the top 4 atm

Maybe, but there would have been no treble last season.