See Sergeant Peppers post above

Poor parenting that......

That to me, is a good thing. It doesn't always help situations, but it shows the standards we have.

The best we can hope for, isn't that it goes quiet. It's that the club shake things up again. That's what Wigan is all about isn't it?

I don't expect a reply, because I've broken the cardinal rule - thou shalt not question the club.

Playing this fixture at the exact time as England v Scotland smacks of arrogance by either one or both of the clubs or superleague. A lot of Wigan folk, whilst not latics fans, are football fans, and particularly when it comes to international tournaments, and even more particularly when it is a fixture between England and Scotland, where no love is lost between the two countries.

Bloke on the other site who has a fishery and has in the past come up with good information says that Williams has signed for Warrington.Players got to his fishery regularly and gets all the gossip.

If by standards, you mean everyone is a moaning bugger then yeah.

Bloody hell, it was only figure of speech. I was moaning about restrictions on crowds.

You're surely not denying that's been a pain in the backside ...

Possibly, just depends on how you see it.

I know you've previously mentioned that regular season games could be dull under Wane, even tho that was a period of success for the club. IL himself kinda acknowledged this when he spoke about "attractive rugby".

Looking at this season, we've lost one game in the league. It's a good position to be in, but I doubt many will say it's been enjoyable. We then see low ticket sales/lack of interest and ask why. If you point out the above as one reason of many, you get labelled as moaning.

He's wrong more often than right, but I think everyone is onto this one by now to be fair.

Ill take your last point first

Breaking the cardinal rule as you say of never questioning the club.
1/who says anyone cant criticise the club?
2/ you, and many others, have criticised the club many times previously (which is fine) so hardly breaking a cardinal rule thats already been broken, ripped up, shredded and incinerated.

With regards to your initial point, I don't strangely enough disagree
And you then say that it makes the club "shake things up again", and once again I don't 100% disagree.

However, the flip side of that is that stability, process, patience etc get thrown put thebwindow and lead to short term thinking and decision making.

Now I don't think for one minute that tweets, Facebook, forums completely shape the Management/owners decision making. In fact I would be alarmed if it did (although the release of dan sarginson does concern me after something IL said at the fans forum).
But I do think that when people talk about there being a general malaise, or that the club is going backwards a lot of it is shaped from the echo Chambers of Facebook,twitter and forums.

Your reply earlier about going back to 2010 which almost dismisses the last 10 years of history, 2 challenge cups, 3 GF wins (and 3 other appearances) and a world club challenge win (plus 3 other appearances) and asking "why should we bother going" whilst saying that the team doesn't turn up half the time and in effect cheating the paying public/wigan fans is case in point.

I'm no Lam fan, and I have criticised him, but trust me I've been quite restrained on him publicly to what I really think. But like anything else in life, there are times when things go for you, times when they don't.
Bounce of a ball so to speak (and i don't want to do the GF debate again, but SOL showed his achilles heel in that final like he has a couple of times in decision making, plus a couple of other small things that I put down to Lam and culture) cost us a GF 6months ago (about 10games ago or so).
Missing 5 or 6 of our backs hasnt helped, coaching decisions in general havent helped imo, the clubs decision making on certain elements hasnt always been great
However, to go from those observations and in a post almost throw away the achievements of the last 10 years is catastrophising a situation too much.
And IMO thats what Wigan fans (certainly a loud minority) do as well if not better than any other club. Rewrite history to suit todays argument or grievance.

Losing field/French at the same time as the gildart/Marshall long term injuries isn't doing us any good, and I certainly feel we would be having different conversations of all 4 of them had been fit for 90% of the games. The club could be criticised for certain parts of that, others is pure bad luck.

I've seen posters talk about Warringtons ambition, willingness to spend big bucks whilst at the same time no mention that it hasnt go them to the big prize, but more astounding is that they choose to ignore the signings of French, Hastings, Burgess, Bateman and that we are in for George Williams (ok we may not get him, but were doing our best) and beating the club up without acknowledging what they are doing well.

I'm all for criticism, but only if its fair, balanced and done in a way that doesn't rewrite history and neglects all the good stuff

The loud minority (IMO) tried to convince everyone Wane had to go, they got their wish
The loud minority (IMO) told us George was no good, he went, and now are criticising if we don't pay over the odds to get him back!
They told us sutton was rubbish and no big loss
Sarginson rubbish
Etc
Etc
They got what they wanted, well done to them.

I've even seen Wigan fans criticse Wigan for attempting to resign gelling based on a BS rumour and then saying that shows our lack of ambition! Unbelievable

They wanted change, they all agreed on that, they got it, now they're putting the blame somewhere else and all coming up with different reason whatbthe clubs doing wrong and different things they do to fix it,. United in their condemnation of IL/Rads/Wane but divided in their ideas how to fix it.

Things are not all rosey, my big worry when we lost Wane was that we would lose our culture, our identity that he (and maguire and to be fair IL facilitated ) implanted 11/12 years ago, I think we have or are starting to.
Were soft, were easy to play against etc and that would never have happened previously.


And final point
Why go Friday? Or words to that effect.

Because its Wigan, my club, and ill go whenever I can
Its my wife's 50th birthday Friday, half way through the celebrations ill be leaving and going to the game and then rushing back for more drinks after either peed off or happy.
And you know what, week after I'll do the same.
Not with an ellgren jacket in happy clapping, ill be critical of players at times, coaching, occasionally referees. But at the same time giving them credit where its due.

WE ARE WIGAN

Wasn't having a dig

You're right, I did say that because it was But you ask why go? Well....Mr Jukesays put it better than I could

[iBecause its Wigan, my club, and ill go whenever I can
Its my wife's 50th birthday Friday, half way through the celebrations ill be leaving and going to the game and then rushing back for more drinks after either peed off or happy.
And you know what, week after I'll do the same.
Not with an ellgren jacket in happy clapping, ill be critical of players at times, coaching, occasionally referees. But at the same time giving them credit where its due[/i

I disagree with quite alot of what the club does off the field and some things anger me more than they ever should do, but it's my club win, lose, draw, play well or play e.

To add to "the reasons"
I'll be able to go to a game with my son, and five friends whom I have hardly seen in fifteen months. We've booked a couple of tables at a pub for a few pre match beers.

It's our team, friends for over forty years and that is through being "thrown together" in the Douggie Stand when it was rebuilt. A few who were in "our gang" have sadly died, but will never be forgotten as long as we can still attend.

It's more than a game, it's more than a club, it's a BIG part of our lives.

I totally agree with Jukesays and would like to add well said Rogues it is a big part of our lives .

Looking forward to going on Friday!
Hope we six thousand fans can give the players tremendous support throughout the game, win lose or draw, by raising the roof.
We’re lucky to support the Wigan club which has given us so many great memories.