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Quote: sergeant pepper "Your living in cloud cuckoo land if you think that expansion sides are the way forward. Why try to flog what is essentially a proven recipe for disaster and ridicule? Do people not realise that every expansion team apart from Catalan have failed? We've been to the rugby mad area of South Wales, we've been to two of Europe's grandest cities in London and Paris and seen nothing of worth. We've been to Cumbria and seen nothing but a few ok seasons for Barrow in the championship. Do i need to go on?

There's a viable future for RL and it's in the hearts and minds of the heartland clubs. It's in the heads of guys like Lenegan, Simon Moran, Eamonn Mcmanus, Adam Pearson, Dr Kukash etc that will drive the game forward. People with passion for the game that want to see it progress and give the fans that love the game what they want.

I think people are sick to death of the way RL is going down the pan. Fans who've followed the game for years are turning down season ticket renewals and instead cherry picking games. There's a gulf in performance and match quality from week to week and people are voting with their feet.

These 'fair weather fans' are the people that we need to get back into the game on a more consistent basis. It's not rocket science that people are more willing to part with hard earned cash if they enjoy what they see, get value for money and have a sniff at success. The quickest way to achieve this is by reducing the teams to 10 and concentrating what is an already diluted player base between a smaller number of sides. If you then up the salary cap we'd stand more of a chance of keeping players.

You talk about having less games in a season means less revenue for the club. I flat out disagree with that. If every game was going to be an epic and close affair which was played to a high standard then we'd see our attendances swell. Take our home game vs Wire for example that should be the norm and not the anomaly when it comes to game standard in this country. Your telling me that more people wouldn't tune in and turn up if every game was played like that. There's zero reason why it can't be - Why can't Hull FC, Wigan, Leeds, Bradford, Warrington, Salford, Saints, Catalan & Huddersfield all be power house clubs? All have the backing to be massive but all are held back by what is in reality Wakefield, Hull KR, Cas & London.'"


Your missing my overall point - There is a rule in business if your not expanding then your shrinking.

Reducing to 10 teams will not automatically spread the talent pool, given the choice players themselves will cherry pick the teams they want to play for and to think there will be a Sam Tomkins at every club is just crazy, there will be 5 or 6 Sam's at the top two clubs because these kind of players know which teams are more likely to challenge for honours and given their talents the clubs will pay for it (with the increased cap).

To say nothing has come from expansion sides is madness, there are more schools and amateur clubs in the south playing rugby league on a regular basis than there were 10 years ago, expansion is not an overnight thing it is built over many decades.

Why will every game be an epic affair, the talent pool isn't that big to have an epic game every week regardless of opposition, no sport has that kind of league and never will have. We will be left with the same type of games we have now, some intense and some walk overs we will just have less games to watch.

So your idea is to bury our head in the sand and reduce to a small minority of clubs playing professionally and hope that ping pong doesn't make a come back and take over our television slot with sky.

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Quote: Grimmy "I mean the average game will be better, because there won't be as many walkovers. Let's say Castleford, Hull KR, London and Widnes go down for example. Instead of

If you play more games against the top clubs then yes it will make for a better spectacle but this does not help build for a better future if a handfull of games against team witihin a 30 mile radius of each other is the only thing we have to look forward too.
RL is the second fastest growing sport in the States, RL is played in some format in many countries across Europe, we need to build on this and not restrict the professional game or we will become even more a minority sport, then these areas where the game is just getting a foothold will die off because of it.
I don't have the answers and im not saying we should just throw a handful of teams into the league from other areas but we need to be actively trying to expand the game and raise it's profile.

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I've seen them bomb a quarter final, bottle a semi final, finish as league leaders, but I've still, never, seen the Wire win the league Doom and gloom, doom and gloom:2553.gif



bang on. always thought he was a very clever bloke. he might sound yorkshire but he talks sense.

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Quote: TrentBarrett "If any one listened to Dr Koukash on BBC Radio Manchester, he spoke about certain big teams using "mechanisms" to spend above the cap, they didn't go into details and Jack Dearden posed the question, "are they cheating?". I'm just curious if any one knows what these mechanisms are?'"


Third party payments to players. What's to stop, for example, one of the Warrington owner's wealthy friends giving money to a player outside the salary cap structure, and the club/player not formally declaring it? Ultimately the RFL don't have the resources to investigate these matters closely, so there will always be ways to circumvent the cap if you have the money.

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The way to expand is a realistic pathway to the top, when you have enough playing the game you look at a Championship team, if that goes well and the player pool increases and likewise crowds you look at going FT - currently the only FT set up is SL, that's a hell of a jump from playing Dewsbury in September to Leeds in February. The second tier provides a logical rung to aim for whilst building a club, new or old, plus it doesn't kill the relegated club.
The second tier must have Toulouse and maybe another French club to make the 10, imo, as the international game must be a big part of why we should do this.
The top tier must be special, 1500-2000 gates at London and Salford do not make it so. Ramshackle stadia at Cas or Wakey do not make it so.

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23 - 20 - 4 Warrington led 16-2 in Saturday's Grand Final, but their joy was short-lived as Wigan roared back to win the Super League title and extend the Wire's 58-year wait to be champions:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_10174.png



Wealthy owners could, for example, give top players credit cards with large credit limits on. Players buy things anonymously and the owner pays off the balance.

Not saying it happens like, just a suggestion eusa_whistle.gif

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[b:35jm31e6][color=#FF0040:35jm31e6]Formerly known as Moonlight Flit[/color:35jm31e6][/b:35jm31e6]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_63362.jpg



Quote: Orrell Lad "Wealthy owners could, for example, give top players credit cards with large credit limits on. Players buy things anonymously and the owner pays off the balance.

Not saying it happens like, just a suggestion

Wot ?

Like how Rugby Union used to be ?

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If your not cheating, your not trying. Barrie Mcdermott:icons3ae4_files/4541-162reymo-msnicons.jpg



Quote: jonh "I really like Peacock, despite his not so great presence in front if the camera, I think he is a very intelligent man, who has real drive and ambition. When he does hang his boots up I would love to see him go into a real administrative position with the RFL not a token appointment either.

Knowing the RFL though they will fall over themselves to give John Wilkin a role because he looks good on TV, despite having 0 substance.'"


Don't disagree regarding peacock, but if RFL only appoint if you look good on TV. What the hell went wrong with the appointment of Nigel Wood!!!!!

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What's to stop a wealthy owner saying 'honour your contract and at the end when you've left i'll give you a big wedge of money as a present'.

A thought on the 3rd fixture too if it goes to 10 team league.

Have the 3rd games as a neutral venue and the 9 neutral matches are a tournament within a tournament.
You still pick up 2 points for the league if you win but there's also a neutral venue cup at the end so whoever wins the most neutral games of the 9 gets a cup end of season, make winning this along with CC winners, GF winners and LLS winners the 4 places for the expanded WCC. You're giving extra spice to some games.
Double head the games and divvy the money out on the walk ups and after sales

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Last nights difference in strength and speed is a big reason why p&r can't happen on a 1 year basis imo. That Leigh team would be down before it got to grips with it. Give them time to get used and add some names and they've a chance. See Widnes for example.

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Are Leigh full time professionals though, i mean proper day in day out 100% all they do is play and train rugby league no other worries aside, full committed players?

Besides with a 10 team league you'll have more current sl standard guys having no choice but to play in SL2 the gap isn't as big as it is meaning transition is easier.

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Quote: Conroy "Last nights difference in strength and speed is a big reason why p&r can't happen on a 1 year basis imo. That Leigh team would be down before it got to grips with it. Give them time to get used and add some names and they've a chance. See Widnes for example.'"


Didn't you beat Widnes with a similar score a few weeks back?

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Quote: Horatio Yed "Are Leigh full time professionals though, i mean proper day in day out 100% all they do is play and train rugby league no other worries aside, full committed players?

Besides with a 10 team league you'll have more current sl standard guys having no choice but to play in SL2 the gap isn't as big as it is meaning transition is easier.'"


AFAIK as with most players in our league, all Leigh's players have 'proper' jobs, and only train in the evenings/Saturday, then play on Sunday. (To which you could argue means they are 'more' fully committed icon_wink.gif )

Well done on the win last night, we enjoyed ourselves and good luck.

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I understand what you say but fully professional have superior skills and fitness and even the fully pro guys struggle against Wigan this season

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I think it's spot on SL and SL 2 for that second division.

I think we need this as soon as is possible.

I'm sick of pandering to the basement teams they're in the basement because the rfl have allowed it. They have poor players because they can't afford better because of crowds but don't get that people will pay to see a superior product.

If they had a chance of winning pretty much any game then more would turn up that's why Wigan and Leeds crowds are so good because you have all the die hards that any club has but you also have all the casual fans that turn up because there's a good chance you'll see a winning Wigan or Leeds.

This guy will be the saviour of our sport IF the RFL get their heads out their bums and listen to him.

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