Exactly, and how many of the home average Super League attandances at the DW Stadium in recent seasons been inflated by games against better away supported clubs like Leeds, Warrington and especially St Helens on Good Friday plus attendances which again been inflated by promotions of reduced and free tickets in the North Stand for games aginst low supported away clubs, especially Catalan.

If less supporters are now travelling to other clubs including Wigan, it would mean that there are now more home supporters watching Wigan which cannot be the case as the club now sells less season tickets than what it use to sell in ten years or so ago.

As for non season ticket games, they are a embarrssment to the club as shown in the recent Grand Final Semi Final game against Leeds when out of a paltry crowd of around 7,000, a third or more was from Leeds who had made a extra effort to cross the Pennines as a result of seeing that they a more than 50% chance of winning the game which turned out to be the case.

Will be intetresting to see how many season tickets will be sold this season as a result of the appoinment of the NEW coaching team, the silence of news about French coming back and the lack of signing some better quality players which has been the case at some of the other clubs since the end of the season.

To keep claiming that crowds at the DW Stadium are better than what they ever were at Central Park is nonsense as many of the quoted attendances at Central Park were far from the acual attendance announced due to various reasons which clubs no longer can get away with in a modern Stadium like the DW Stadium.

How many times did any of you go to Central Park and come off saying, "the crowd appeared to be lot bigger than whats been announced"?

During the war

Are you saying the Gang of 4 were tax cheats and should have been prosecuted ?

Only saying that the crowd figures at the time always appeared to be lower than the actual number of supporters at a game and it was not just at Central Park. I was even told at the time to add 10% to whatever crowd figure was produced by the clubs because of the losses sustained on the non computorised and small turnstiles and entry to a stadium was by cash and not tickets. Not to mention the other ways of getting into a older stadium which you cannot do at a modern Stadium like the DW.

Draw your own conclusions about what was going on, but when it comes to comparing the crowd figures of the old grounds with those of new modern stadium, also think about the difference in the level of security of the older stadiums compared to that of the new modern stdiums with their computorised and full length turnstiles, alarms on exit doors, security company stewarts and no paying cash at the turnstiles.

Like I have said, you cannot compare the crowd figures of older stadiums like Central Park with those of the new modern stadiums like the DW when different circumstances in a different era are involved.

Now, in spite of less season tickets being sold and less away supporters coming the to the DW Stadium now, the crowd figures are claimed as being higher than in great days of success at Central Park during the sixties, eighties and nighties.

Which War?

First, Second or Cod?

But you are comparing them, and conveniently ignoring the seventies. Some of the crowds in the mid to late sixties were very poor.

You can only take factual information as provided by the published figures, not what "somebody told me"!!!

"The crowd appeared higher" that's an opinion. Would the Inland Revenue not have thought it a little strange, all these thousands of people not being accounted for?

So you are saying they were using illegal practices, thanks, just wanted to confirm.
I mean surely no-one can condone that can they?
No wonder we ended up owing the tax man so much back in the mid late nineties and ended up losing the stadium etc
Your also saying that there were hundreds/thousands of "Wigan fans" who were prepared to watch Wigan but didn't want to pay?
Nothing changed there then, except now they don't get in, just sit on forums like this, twitter and Facebook and constantly moaning about everything telling everyone what's wrong with the club whilst contributing F*** All

And here's me thinking the gang of 4 could do no wrong

PS
20 seasons prior to leaving Central Park average attendance 11,195 FACT (if I went back and included 70s it would be AWFUL)
Just counting Last 10 years at Central Park average 12,190 FACT
20 seasons up to 2019 at New stadium average 13,420 FACT

And when you consider the perception is LESS away fans attend now than previously it actually stand up very well that there may actually be MORE Wigan supporters going to align games than previously at Centeal Park

And pre empting your next get out clause. You've insinuated that our crowds over the last 20 years have been inflated by 1 or 2 bigger crowds a year.
Well, 8/9/10 times in those 20 years the largest crowd was virtually double or more than our average
It's nowhere near at the DW (to be fair I'm not sure about 2018/19) that Amy single attendance has been double our average.
In fact, without going all mathematical on you, the figures for the last 20 years at Central Park were inflated by a smaller percentage of games (1/2/3 larger games per year against Saints/Widnes/Warrington etc) and a lot of the smaller crowds were far lower than what we get at the DW.

if you did take the top 2 games a year off the average for those years the gap between our crowds at Central Park and at the DW would be even greater and the gap showing crowds at the DW which are bigger for last 20 years would be even greater FACT
This means our crowds are far more consistent now than they were at Central.Park

On other threads people have talked about Fridays/Sundays
Fact is our crowds have been greater when we have had a greater number of Friday games.

The big difference is between central park and DW is social media
Back in the day there weren't tens of thousands of no it all experts slagging every tiny little thing off consistently and trying to turn every positive into a negative and every negative into a disaster.
It's surprising our crowds are as decent given the way a large percentage of our supposed "Fan Base" seem intent on sabotaging and running us down.
Previous they just bored people to death at home or in a pub or supermarket, now they can moan and thousands of people hear and see it.

Yes, but what about the gang of four??

As Corporal Jones says, "They don't like it up um"

They, being the usual handful who never see anything wrong with the decining lack of season ticket holders, away supporters, poorer crowds and not winning trophies like in the past and a squad no longer at the level it should be for a top club like Wigan.


I only know that in the days of Central Park, supporters could in addition to watching Wigan, also watch Challenge Cup Semi Finals, Internationals and World Cup games, a pre season sevens competition, Amateur and Schoolboys Finals and Internation games, even the final of the Ken Gee Trophy.

Now at the souless joint DW Stadium, all Wigan supporters can watch are Super League/Play Off games, less Challenge Cup ties, a possible Academy Final and the occasional World Cup Challenge game.

No Internationals or other special games. Not even a game in next season's World Cup Competition,

And to add insult to injury, the club have to play games at other Stadiums like Leigh and Widnes, if games clash with the Latics if they are in the Premiership.

And some say that nothing is wrong with Wigan playing in a joint DW stadium and there is stll the same level of interest and better attendances then what they would have got in a new Stadium of their own.

We were duped by Whelan and the Council and it is time some in Wigan faced up to it!

We were laughing in 1999 when we moved to a new Stadium while Leigh, Salford, St Helens and Warrington were still playing in their out of date grounds at Hilton Park, The Willows, Knowsley Road and Wilderspool.

We are not laughing now!

bloody hell John Ferguson would have been happy with that side step and shimmy

so your argument that crowds are crap at the DW was blown out of the water with a 20 year average of the respective stadiums, so you resort back to the old but we used to play the Ken Gee cup at Central Park. Did we not play home games at Central Park v Saints, as thats another one of your arguments blown out the water as the average is inflated by good crowd v Saints. You really are clutching at straws with some of your arguments

yes we did have all these other games played at Central Park but times move on, and we wouldnt get any benefit from them being played at DW as we dont own the ground, as it is now a football stadium as we have been sold down the swanny by Whelan. But to keep reverting back to things 25-30 years ago about how good they were is just plain boring. We had the best side in the world at that point in time, but still our average attendance is worse than it is now

As a club a decision needs to be made about the future. Do we accept that the new owners can seemingly try to shaft us whenever they feel like the want a bit more money out of us or do we stand our ground and ensure that its the best deal for Wigan Rugby (or look into the possiblity of our own ground - yes we can all argue til the cows come home about the pros and cons of that one too). We get nothing from match day revenues ie beer and pie sales, so if our rent is going up, as a club we should really be pushing the Robin Park arena, and hold everything pre and post match over there, and stuff the new owners. as a set of fans we shouldnt buy another thing whilst in the ground, and let the bugger feel it with no match day sales. Take your own food / drink with you, and have pints pre and post match.

in terms of your clubs laughing at us you do realise Salford are about to move cos they cant afford to play at the stadium, Leigh dont own theirs, i can also add Hull and Huddersfield to that list

Yes Saints and Wire have nice new stadiums, so are probably quite rightly crowing it over us as fans, but what has it done for Wire, their forum is more negative than the Wigan forums and that takes some doing

Is that the same Salford that are being kicked out of their stadium?

Or Leigh that don't own their own stadium, and trsut me, have had numerous issues with the council over the cost of it

Correct, the Stadium at Leigh is owned by the Council which should have been the case at Wigan.

The Council did not make the same mistake twice!

They are not being kicked out, they have been offered the Stadium of Salford FC due to the horrendus cost of playing at the A J Bell Stadium. Sale Sharks and Salford FC who are part owned by well off ex. United footballers are now in the EFL with ambitions of going higher are going in a partnership to buy the AJ Bell Stadium.

According to a Salford Red Devils supporter who I know, he has told me that the club would be better off as the Salford FC Stadium as it is in the traditional heart of the City of Salford which is not the case where the AJ Bell Stadium is situated.

If the deal happens, Salford Red Devils from what I understand will have a Stadium of their own like they had at the Willows which is more than can be said for Wigan Warriors playing at the DW Stadium.

Yip - Still require a Time Machine Doc Brown or else your incessant regurgitation of the same old story means nothing
But still pointless replying as your not going to respond when you don't like Facts getting in the way - No reply to the attendances comparison I posted ????