Another problem is that there's bgr-all coverage on terrestrial telly. Not everyone has or wants Sly, so we're limited to the BBC's highlights at silly o'clock on a Monday (although Wales v Serbia WC qualifier is on S4C on Saturday btw, if anyone's bothered). The yawnion brigade will effectively scupper anything the Beeb might want to do to properly cover the game, but if they or C4 [icould[/i either afford or were willing to wrest coverage off Murdoch & co, it would help promote a wider (initially couch-based) audience and garner interest that could bring people to the stadiums.
Unfortunately, I think there are too many variables and we're in the middle of the perfect storm, where little coverage, stagnant funding, inept leadership (Red Hall) and vested interests are conspiring to bring the game down. Success in the 4 Nations would help and a decent run next year in the WC, but personally until the various Neros at Red Hall put their fiddles down, I think we'll be forever considered the game that's played up north by lard-@rses in flat caps chewing on black puddings with a ferret in our kecks.

I don't. I post on very few threads.

Yes I interpret the meaning of "fan" in a literal way. I can't abide people who criticise the club but never even go to a game. But there are thousands like me who follow the club through thick and thin home and away. So I don't think I'm the greatest fan. But in my world you have to earn the right to have an opinion mate. One that counts anyway.

If people are offended by my posts I'm sorry. I don't use abusive or profane language. I make my points. If you prefer I didn't then that's probably why, as DaveO posted, the boards go quiet. There are times when the negativity is expressed in an objectionable way.

My default position is this. Rugby League is the toughest team sport in the world and the players always give their all. Criticising their commitment or skills from the safety of a keyboard is unfair and lame. Wigan are my team but they have no God given right to win things. The best we should hope for is to compete each year. Anything else is a bonus.

If you believe that I'm telling you what to think then you'd be right. Isn't that what debate is for? I might respect your opinion if it is expressed reasonably but I'm going to argue if I disagree.

I've come on here and posted plenty of times when I've been wrong. I thought Tautai was a liability. I was wrong. I though we should sign Danny Brough and not play George Wiiliams last year. I was wrong. But about Shaun Wane I was right. So were plenty of others. After winning the GF can't you even allow me the opportunity to rub it in to those who were wrong?

Wigan Peer is right..In YOUR opinion..However YOUR opinion is not everyones.

The season was very poor standard and then the Widnes game happened.

That was one of the worst ever performances for many years, especially under the Wane and Maguire years.

Then suddenly, the team with no change of personnel turned into a different beast.

Why did this happen, was it because you were sat in the stands clapping away after the defeat??

Or was because of the amount of critisism forced or made someone force Waney to change what he was doing??

Because he changed dramatically the way the team was allowed to off the cuff attack.

I think if you look back over peoples posts even the very critical ones praised the team effort and defence.

You've been all over the place having a pop at anyone you can, but your still wrong.

Your strutting around on the forum now putting anyone who was unhappy with Waney down.

But didn't have the B@lls to come on here and defend like purple cheese did during the season and even he had enough after the Widnes game.

We won and i'm delighted and if we can play like the last 6 weeks 70% of next season even if we don't win the GF then i'd hope Waney would have a contract extension.

But this season until the last 6 weeks has been the lowest point for the club in performance for some time, injuries is not an excuse because the same players turned into a different team so it was tactics..

As Brucie says.....Keep Clapping..

So it only because of you & people similar to you "Forcing Change"?
Well Done, I'm sure you'll be proud wearing your super league ring that the club will present you & the others with.

The rest of this is a General statement not specifically aimed at anyone in particular.

As for Aboveusonlypie "Attacking" other posters I can only look at the post that triggered this off?
He had a bit of a dig at DaveO, nowhere near what other posters have dished out over the many months that Wane etc. were under the cosh.
Now if there's been many other posts over the last 12 months were personal abuse has been handed out by said poster I'll stand corrected however I don't remember seeing it.
On the other hand the fact that the board (And the other one BTW) seem to be far busier in times of trouble than when we are doing well speaks a lot.
I get accused of being a Happy clapper and if anything I am on the slightly positive side however I believe my posts/thoughts are made after assessing information and trying to understand the Bigger picture.
The Bateman issue in point.
Could not believe the amount of criticism the club took for not telling everyone everything, not responding to the clamour to give us all the detail etc.
Sack Mossop (Because he's a bad player) and keep Bateman (because he's a Good one) type comments.
Hadn't anyone heard of employment law, privacy & Confidentiality etc.!
Only reason Mossops getting away with it is because he's in the clique type comments, seriously, does anyone believe that!

FWIW - I am critical of organising the event and "Policing" the event in the way they did, but how they dealt with the situation once it had happened I thought they did fantastically well given "The Bigger picture".

I know "Some" of the stuff Wane & The club alluded to (Not all I may stress) and I admire the way they've dealt with a lot of things thrown at them this year (Believe it or not I think some of them are the clubs own fault in some ways).
I don't think anyone was so blind as to think that there were no problems, however given a lot of circumstances, some that the fans did know about, some they COULDN'T be told about to me it was understandable that things didn't go our way for a lot of the season.

One thing I will not accept though is the "We complained and that's why things changed Brigade" claiming it was there intervention that saved the season.
It stands about as much weight as those that say they supported the team through the hard times and the club/players did it for them Brigade.

It just seems for the last couple of years that the Critical posters seem to be able to have a pop at the Happy clappers and IMHO seem to get away with more name calling and personal insults to those posters and the players/coach they're talking about.
Yet when the "happy clappers" get their moment in the sun the Critical posters (We need a catchy name for them just like Happy Clappers have) seem to object and seem to want to say it was them that were right all along.

PS

I've resisted the temptation to revive the "Our Forwards" thread were I had a similar difference of opinion with Itchy Arsenal.
In some ways I want to ram it down his throat, but understand that just because we won the GF it doesn't make all of his points redundant, we were poor, some times too poor for the situation we found ourselves in (i.e. even with all those injuries we did some times look clueless).

What I did and do object to is Blanket statements that claim we have Rubbish players, coaches and in some ways it turns to personal attacks when it appears posters aren't taking scenarios into account and bearing in mind there may be others that we or the general public aren't aware of.

I have a work colleague (And if your reading Pal it was a shame I didn't see you after the both the Hull and Warrington games! )
He has a personal dislike of Shaun Wane, has had since day 1.
EVERY opportunity, EVERY defeat it's the same thing.
Yet when we win nothing.

When we were going through the injury crisis mid season and we strung "X" amount of wins together I saw him maybe 7/8 games in a row coming off the away grounds and I said in response to his "They don't like Waney, The players want him out" type comments this.

You can tell the players want to play for him
You can tell the players are working their hardest for him & the club
You can tell these lads have Team spirit, they're winning games they've no right to.

Don't know if I'm out of order here and may get a telling off
But I know RADS gave a speech at the end of the Semi Final and he singled Waney out for praise for dealing with a lot of what he's had to deal with this year.
The players & Back room staff to a man stood and applauded.
Speaks volumes.

Anyway - Stands back and awaits response from the "Crappy Clappers" - Come on guys, it's up t you to come up with something better!

Sounds very fair to me, Juke.

If a tad long.

The turning point in our season wasn't straight after the Widnes game (although we did have to come from behind to beat Hull away) it was a gritty but typical Wigan performance.

The game after we played Wire away and for the first hour we were 2nd best and losing 28-14. At that point we then lost Flower with twenty more minutes to go.

We should have been dead and buried but a light switched on and we never looked back. It was around this time our attacking tactics changed.

So you only want to talk about the change that took place after the Widnes game? (Maybe you cant be d reading the rest and to be honest who can blame you).

But what I was trying to do in one post was explain that neither the Happy clappers nor the Crappy clappers were the reason for the success at the end of the season.
I was also trying to explain why some of the Happy Clappers may feel the need to say "I told you so" in the same way as those who want to claim that it was their vociferous abuse/criticism that forced the club/coaches/players to change want to say "I told you so".

My personal opinion on some of the personal stuff on here is that the "Happy clappers" take a lot more stick personally from other posters and often get accused of being idiotic, deluded etc. in posts aimed at them from some of the others and it gets ignored more.

But in reverse when stick is handed out the other way the more critical posters tend to stand up for themselves and turn it into a big deal.

Anyway - I also Think Matty B has a point - After Widnes the Hull performance wasn't that much different and the first 50mins at Wire away also.

And therein lies the issue

And before you say - If you didn't actually read what I said then Why bother to quote me that it was too long? Just ignore it, make your own comment - But no - make a snide remark etc.

You can bet your life that if it was a similar length post stating that Wane was the Devil incarnate, Ape, Bully etc. it would have been read and an applause or like attached!

It was tongue in cheek, I skimmed over it. It really has nothing to do with the topic title though does it for your average family of fans does it? It's merely fans point proving. Is that what will improve attendences? Like I say, too much drama. To answer the question on topic, I did just that.

Well I suggest that you do read it in it's entirety.

I just have, some good points. But as I said, none of it really is going to put any extra bums on seats, which was my point, which probably should have been made without the comment. I just feel there's too much drama amongst the fans at the moment and we all get a little hysterical one way or another, whilst there maybe a group on here, how many don't post and aren't interested in petty squabbles on forums? Most just want the odd big name signing and want to watch good rugby. That's my point really, that when it comes to retaining fans and getting people back in, we need to forget pointless forum discussions as basically it's irrelevant and it's the club that need to do something.

Juke don't think it's overly long and the vast majority of what you say is pretty balanced and a good read.
Personalty I'm delighted that I got it so wrong in that I thought we were incapable of winning the GF. If people want to take the urine out of me for getting it wrong I've no problem as long as it is done without being abusive and ideally I'd prefer it with a bit of humour.
I still think we were awful to watch for 75% of the season and nothing will change my view on that point.
The turning point for me was when our forwards started playing and acting like forwards and all this shoite about "middles" was despatched to the gant (one for the teenagers to research) where it belongs.

Hypothetically, what if Wigan signed Albert Kelly to go along with Morgan Escare. You would have two of the most exciting ball runners in Rugby League in the same team. Would the "We want attractive rugby" pundits be happy? I'm sure it could be exciting, however I doubt we'd win anything.