I think we need to cut Williams some slack. Neither of the half backs will look back on the game with any satisfaction.
I've said previously that this year really is a transitional season due to the change at halfback and prop.
I didn't go to the game but watched on Wigan tv and to me Saints basically out "Wiganed" us. They were far more aggressive, energetic and in the first half made very few basic errors. They will be the team to beat this season.
I personally think that Williams and Smith are too similar however, SW knows them both far better than me so you have to give the partnership time to gel.
The overall poor display by our forwards was far more worrying for me. Size is obviously important however, we lacked direction and composure.
SW has got a busy couple of weeks in front of him to sort out some of the issues but he will learned several things from yesterday over and above the performance of the half backs. Tomkins ain't a centre and he never will be. Hampshire does not look like a full back and in all probability won't be the long term solution to this problem. Crosby needs to run with same aggression he puts in his tackling
I think going forward he will start with Hampshire on the bench with either Williams or Smith covering the hooker role if MM can't/doesn't play the full 80 minutes.
Overall a very disappointing performance but hopefully it's a case of getting this type of performance out of our system.
I for one expect an up down season until Flower is back and Mossop has confirmed his ongoing match fitness. A little patience will be needed in the short term.

I heard somebody coming out of the ground saying Williams is rubbish and calling him not fit to burn which is a typical attitude in some sections of our support! The lad is a top class young player but he needs time and support to develop and will have his ups and downs. To judge him on a game were half his eventual first choice pack is missing and write him off is pathetic.

I said in the off season I have no worries going with the three young lads because they'll push each other and drive each other on. If Williams does struggle early doors this season then Hampshire may get a go but in truth I think Sam Powell will get the spot when he's back. I think Powell may have been kept away from the 6 jersey to keep him away from the limelight a little and to take the pressure off.

Whoever gets the spot short term or longer term needs patience and most will show it. Wigan have looked like the side that turned up at Bradford and Wakey last year in these friendlies but come Widnes I expect the standards that we showed in the last few weeks of the season and the play offs. That side will give whoever is at 6 far more room to work with then they've had these past two weeks.

Must admit I am not a big fan of pre-season friendlies. For the most part they are simply an opportunity for the players to blow away the cobwebs and for the coach to try a few different combinations.

By the way Jerri Seu Seu was an awesome player for Wigan.......in the friendlies!

For the love of God PLEASE do not use the phrase "TRANSITIONAL YEAR" again. It seems to have become a way of happy clappers justifying failure at our club. We've heard it every season for the past 10 years as well. Even when we won the double!

I don't see what the great panic is about our pack. The only top end player we have lost is Scott Taylor. Who didn't even play the last few months of the year or in the playoffs.

Taylor/Dudson/James OUT
Tautai/Mossop/Patrick IN

6 is an issue but personally I think Sam Powell will have that spot nailed within the first half of the year.

Think your all going overboard about pack weakness given the players you had out.

Having said that, well be interesting to see how reliable SOL and Mossop are this year and there appears to be some confusion in the halves but it's a long season and the young lads will be different players in September to what they are now.

When you look at it on paper there really isn't an issue. They just need to get everyone fit and on the field.

Oh don't talk rubbish, our season is finished, our pack is weak and we can't possibly switch the team around as we move through the season. Our season has been decided in two friendlies.

Now take your logical thinking elsewhere, it isn't welcome here, it gets in the way of some serious negativity.

The great panic about the pack is this - put our best two props (I've no idea who they might be) against the best two from Saints and Warrington, and what happened on Sunday will occur every time we play a top team. Sure, we will be ok against most of the rest.

And the great panic about our 6 is this, it is a pivotal position in which we have lost a lot of big game experience - Saints have Burns, Wire have Ratchford and the others have the likes of Carney, McGuire and Brough. We have three kids who might be great in future but they aren't ready.

If you were there on Sunday this was all amply illustrated. If you think friendlies don't matter then fair enough, I agree that the result doesn't matter, but it was a very competitive game. What Amor, Walmsley and Masoe did on Sunday may be replicated throughout the season and it won't be pretty to watch.

Personally I would have used some of the Sam money and bought Brough or Carney. And I would have brought over a seasoned NRL prop like Wire and Leeds have done. I'm a bit sick of losing seasoned pros and replacing them with kids.

Mossop - Flower
Amor - Walmsley
Hill - Simms
Peacock - Singleton/Cuthbertson
Casty - Lima

I wouldn't say where too far behind tbh. I'd say Wire and then Saints have the best pair of props.

If you add in the back row and 13 aswell.

Flower - Mossop - Farrell - Tomkins - O'Loughlin
Hill - Simms - Laithwaite - Westwood - Harrison
Amor - Walmsley - Vea - Greenwood - Wilkin

I don't think our pack is too shabby myself.

Having an experienced 6 would have been beneficial for one year max, if the three young lads aren't ready yet they aren't far off that's for sure.

Carney was a no go for anyone other than Catalan due to his previous convictions.

The wire pack looks the weakest of the ones above.

We're fine in the forwards. We have five players to go back in to that pack including the starting England second row and the England captain (and the leagues best player) as well as three prop forwards.

Offer me any pack in the league ahead of ours and I wouldn't swap it. We've been ordinary in 2 friendlies but I wouldn't write us off just yet! I only hope our rivals are dragged in to thinking we've got as many problems as some of our fans seem to believe.

3 yrs ago we beat Hudds in our second preseason friendly by 40 points, we all thought we'd walk the league. 2 weeks later when it mattered Hudds reversed that result, we went on to lose the next 6 or so too. Royce got the sack and our season was ruined.
Preseason friendly form means very little

It doesn't mean a great deal but I'd be excited as a Saints fan to think that you've got Walsh and LMS to come back in to that side. I said on your board a few weeks back I thought you were a big second rower away from looking pretty well rounded and in Greenwood I think you've got your man.

I'll be honest now, last year Saints got some unbelievable slices off luck to win the trophies they did but we've had that ourselves in the past (Wires injuries in the 2013 GF for example). This year though I'd put you as the team to beat with Wigan and Wire just in behind. I saw a weakness in that backrow that we could exploit but Vea and Greenwood have left me unsure on that. The rest of the side has no real question marks against it.

Im cautiously optimistic. Leeds will be very intersting this year, they look alot weaker