Experience doesn't necessarily mean just trophies. What about the experience of playing under different coaches/regimes? Or the experience of still being able to perform when results are seriously not going your way and the fans are on your back? I wonder who the players take their lead off when change happens or when the poop hits the fan. I'd wager the answer for most players is Hansen and Lockers

All good points - and I'm certain that Lockers is a perfect role model.

But our young players have already hit highs and lows in the last two seasons.

And I'm afraid that you are seriously over-rating HH. Look at the stats for last season. He is a liability in attack and his defence, whilst good, is certainly not far superior to any of the other forwards especially Lockers, Faz, Flower, MMc. He certainly misses more tackles than anyone (apart from MMc). Even Jack Hughes measures up pretty well against HH and he's supposed to have had a poor season.

HH has been great for Wigan for a good few years now but I supect that the coaching staff who look at this stuff in excruciating detail have concluded that HH is expendable. And I agree.

I agree that some of the younger players have got plenty of first team games under their belt, but none of the ones you've mentioned can really be seen as leaders. If you look at the leadership team that Madge implemented in 2010, most of those players have moved on, all apart from Lockers in fact, plus we've lost another 2 senior figures this year in Sam and Pat, and there aren't that many in a similar mould in the current squad. I'm not talking about senior players just with a regards to age or number of games, but also leadership qualities. Having a number of figures around him definitely helped Lockers kick on when he wasn't having to shoulder all the responsibilty himself.

FWIW I don't actually think it would be a massive disaster if H did move on this year, but ideally I'd want him to do another year.

Fair points.

How about the following with leadership qualities - MMc/Matty/Blake/Faz?

I don't know enough about Bowen/Pettybourne - maybe they are good leaders.

And supposedly one of the things that most impressed SW about Tony Clubb are his leadership qualities (mind you he'll have to make the team first)

What i would say about hansen is the stats will rarely tell the story of his efforts in defence. He, along with mcilorum, oloughlin and more recently flower, absolutely steamrolls people. Again and again in the big games. We saw liam farrell mature last season, and hughes play in a fair number of games back in the second row, but neither will currently bring that ability to dominate defensively that i personally feel is key to how wigan perform in the big games.

This is a very good point. Stats cannot show how hard someone hits in a tackle and this in Rugby League does make a huge difference.

Unfortunately for Wigan this is already a done deal, any of the young Wigan lads coming through the youth system are on a hiding to nothing at the moment.

If Lenagan keeps penny pinching like he is at the minute, bringing over high paid NRL imports then H's departure will not be the last, Tuson, Mossop ETC.

A good indicator of someone like H's standing in the team is the massive uproar that his departure has created with the other players in the team when they found out recently.

Penny pinching AND bringing over high paid NRL imports?

Can you really be guilty of both at the same time?

Well if the current regime continues, through its management to bring continued success, then so be it... The message to the young players is, if you are good enough, you get a chance... You ought to look at the players who have been given debuts, and how many are currently in 1st choice berths, and the size of the squad, which has a high number of classy youngsters waiting in the wings... I will be sad to see H go, if he does, but I also look forward to seeing his replacements stake a claim... We have to move on, sentimentality has no place in team/squad selection... You must also consider that H may actually WANT to leave...

Didn't you previously tell us he was signing for NZ Warriors, and that we were signing Paul Wood?

never heard that before...

All that before the 2013 season then nothing happened....

Is it just me Grimmy or have you just proved Mr Headline right?

his quote says end of 2013 and a "potential" move?

If Hock has been persuaded to stay by Koucash why couldn't Hansen?

no smoke without fire and all that!

Apparently Hansen has bought a new 5 bedroom house in Leigh, so he's not likely to leave these shores, and a mate who knows his family says he couldn't afford a 5 bedroom house with the wages Wigan were paying him.