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Quote: 21-12 "In response to Last son of Wigan's question about what my team would be next year

1. Tomkins
2. Charnley
3. Hughes
4. Thornley/Goulding but preferably a signing if anyone decent is available.
5. Richards
6. Green
7. Smith
8. Mossop
9. McIlorum
10. Prescott
11. Hock
12. Hansen
13. Lockers

Hardly the world 13, but blame the Communist Cap for that, it has and will continue to drag our sport down until we reach the point where we are all playing at the level that London are at now.'"



Murphy
Charnley Hughes Carmont (1 more yr) Richards
Tomkins Smith
Dudson McLlorum Mossop
Hock Hansen
Lockers
---------------------
Flower Fielden Faz another.

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Quote: 21-12 "
Back onto Goulding, he's good on a Sunday afternoon when your winning at London with 40 points, he's never had a good game in a big game, not this season anyway. The semi he was awful, and he was abismal last night, by no means am I using him as a scapegoat, iv said it for quite some time about him, he's a static defender, anyone with good feet goes round him with ease (i.e Josh jones last night) Hughes as an all round rugby player offers far more IMO, both in defence and in attack.
'"

goulding gave space, but always recovered to make the tackle which is the important part in the . him and charnley also rarely gave the winger space last night which is impressive when a man down. and also, how often do shine when a team is a man down. generally a needs at least a 2 on 2 to make space/draw a man. when a man down its far more unlikely goulding was ever going to crack the defences last night. goulding has shown he can make space for his winger and also has cracking hands. he may not have the speed but i feel he covers his cracks.

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Quote: the wrestler "goulding gave space, but always recovered to make the tackle which is the important part in the centres. him and charnley also rarely gave the winger space last night which is impressive when a man down. and also, how often do centres shine when a team is a man down. generally a Centre needs at least a 2 on 2 to make space/draw a man. when a man down its far more unlikely goulding was ever going to crack the defences last night. goulding has shown he can make space for his winger and also has cracking hands. he may not have the speed but i feel he covers his cracks.'"


He's an average player who shines against the poor teams, give me an example of his doing something outstanding in a big game this season?

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Quote: 21-12 " Nothing will change though in attack, Wane doesn't know how to change it. We'll just keep "knocking teams about" and "getting stuck in" until we meet Wire, and once again, he'll get outcoached from Smith.'"



Totally agree.

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Quote: 21-12 "Blessing in disguise for Wigan the sending off, Tommy at 9, Smith 7 Finch 6. Far more creativity in attack. We are ridiculously predictable in attack, 2 dummy runners, Sam loops round the back. If that doesn't work we turn it back inside to Lima/Mossop. Poor, poor coaching. This isn't a kneejerk reaction to a loss, iv said it all season, weve finished top of what id say is the worst Super League ever.

'"


With by far the best attack, which has scored well over 200 tries this season. In all our losses, including the CC semi, it's been our defence that was to blame, conceding 30+ points in most of them.

And regarding Goulding, if a winger scores 37 tries (so far) in a season, it's a fair bet that he has a good centre inside him.

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Quote: 21-12 "Nothing will change though in attack, Wane doesn't know how to change it. We'll just keep "knocking teams about" and "getting stuck in" until we meet Wire, and once again, he'll get outcoached from Smith.'"


That's a bit unfair IMO. Granted, we were murdered by them at the HJ but if it wasn't for 3 minutes of stupidity from Lauaki we'd have won the game at our place, he certainly wasn't outcoached that night.

If we attack like we did at the magic weekend, and put that amount of effort and character in like last night then I'm not worried. I've seen more than enough from Wane's Wigan this year to tell me we can win our next 3 games.

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Quote: Geoff "With by far the best attack, which has scored well over 200 tries this season. In all our losses, including the CC semi, it's been our defence that was to blame, conceding 30+ points in most of them.

And regarding Goulding, if a winger scores 37 tries (so far) in a season, it's a fair bet that he has a good centre inside him.'"


We started the season well, as of late our attack has been VERY predictable.

As for your second comment, Charnley scores an awful lot of solo tries were he beats his opposite man and goes round them with pace so I wouldn't read too much into that

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Quote: 21-12 "He's an average player who shines against the poor teams, give me an example of his doing something outstanding in a big game this season?'"

i guess i should qualify before i go searching, do any of the matches we won count?

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Of course.

Fire away............

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Quote: tank123 "Like a school kid playing his first game. Best thing all night as him having a go at the staff for pulling him off after 20 minutes. Thought he went ok 1st spell defended ok but nothing with the ball. Second spell went well with the ball.

Should be in the side for the next game for me.'"


when he went off after first spell he was top tackler....doubt a first timer would do that.
i agree in attack tho, he was mainly a dummy runner, but it kept saints guessing

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Quote: 21-12 "We started the season well, as of late our attack has been VERY predictable.

As for your second comment, Charnley scores an awful lot of solo tries were he beats his opposite man and goes round them with pace so I wouldn't read too much into that'"


Exactly. Could argue Charnley would have scored more with Inglis as his centre by that logic.

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For what it's worth this was my post after the Wire game...

"Beaten, bullied, out played.

Our attack seems highly predictable, seems to be the same movement every week, half/dummy runner to half/dummer runner to Sam linking up from the back causing a 3 v 2 overlap with Daz and Josh on his outside. From this we seem to get either Sam dummy and go, pass to Daz or cut out ball to Josh. (Of course this movement is evident on the other side of the pitch with George etc).
9/10 it works against lesser teams. its fast and with Sam's ability we score from it. But against a good coach it becomes transparent. Wire easily cancelled out our best attacking weapon (Sam) simply by having JM cut in and stop the moment when Sam is about to take on the ball. Regardless of such predictably there was no plan B.

In contrast when St George were coached by Wayne Bennett they perfected the moment whereas the defence had no idea who was going to run, who was going to be the dummy runner and who was going to finish with the ball.

They used Soward to break away, from here the defence would not know if he's going to take on the line or pass, with this he had a SR Ben Creagh alongside with Cooper and Morris as an attacking centre/winger partnership. To add another threat Boyd joined the line from FB. At this point any of the mentioned could be the ball carrier, anyone the dummy runner. When the 5 attack down the flank in a line the 3/4 of the opposition would be scared to death of what was going to come next.

We don't have such movement, we look predictable, basically cancel Sam and you've stopped our attack, with StG if Boyd was stopped one of the others would be still a threat.

I think we have the players to create something different, the drills need to be practised and coached, I barely see any other pattern, we play into the oppositions hands.

Warrington like to throw the 'first punch' hit us hard and keep on the pressure from the get-go, the opposition tire from tackle after tackle and become vulnerable and exposed, and of course when you're tired you are more likely to make mistakes. This happened, it's almost as if Wane fires up certain players so much they lose their heads, case in point Micky.

This season Micky has proven his ability as a top 9, however, at times, when fired up he seems more concerned with intensity and letting us all know how 'ard he is' rather than keeping a cool head. If he was a backrower it would be different, but as a 9 you must have composure and awareness, I for one have never ever seen Cam Smith lose his cool, today of all days, playing with just a single 9 he had to be so in-control, I feel he wasn't, (at one point he was rolling on the floor with Moz to show us how 'ard he is'.
This created such a negative impact, at times when we needed to generate momentum getting on a roll with the forwards we never did, Micky wasn't at the races. If he cooled down and became a 'game leader' rather that an enforcer we'd would have had more chance of winning the arm-wrestle.

The forwards were rattled, Wire brought an 'origin esque' attitude, a winning mentality which has been inspired by their coach and key on on field leaders, Morley showed his calibre and leadership which Hill followed with great effect. Westwood showed his winning desire and played for his life. Excellent mentality throughout.
In opposition to this who are actually our leaders? Lockers, love him, great player, but leader? Undecided. We have some excellent props but who's the enforcer/leader? If one of the props matched Morley maybe Micky wouldn't feel the need to enforce from 9. Eric for me was the best player, he brought it, pity Mossop didn't stand up, and I think it's about time Prescott was pushed to one side for other props, can't remember seeing a prop lose the ball so much on impact. Lima worked hard but he needs more support.
Hock is 'origin' in his approach but seems to have trouble raising intensity without losing his head, with this Wane panics and takes him off.

We don't seem mentally ready. Maybe Wane's I'll shout them down get angry until they play better approach isn't always the best way to deal with a beaten team. We almost seem nervous and afraid of Wire, we shouldn't be.

It's time for a plan B, more options in attack with a strong steel mentality which shows no fear, no backing down. Won't lose our heads or temperament but we'll tackle so hard they will be scared to take the line on."

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anyone know if tommy is ok,he limped off last night.

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Quote: 21-12 "He's an average player who shines against the poor teams, give me an example of his doing something outstanding in a big game this season?'"


St Helens game at Manchester Magic?

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