I'd be quite happy with Joel Tomkins at Wire - would be a good replacement for Benny or Louis when they pack in. No better than them and no worse at the minute - they are probably the 3 best 2nd rows in SL right now.

I was suprised it wasnt a "8" pointer.....mind you he would have had to award the penalty 1st.

Hock and Tomkins in the 2nd row for you next season looks superb but by christ there will be some penaltys dished out.

See you all next week.

Surely you are joking, Louis Anderson and Ben Westwood are better than Joel. Anderson is just a thug and Westwood is a good hard working second row but he doesn't have the ability to go the full length whereas Joel Tomkins does.

IMO Joel Tomkins is the best second rower in Superleague and if he was Australian would be playing SOO and maybe for Aus.

As a Saints fan I totally disagree with this. Joel Tomkins is an outstanding back row forward who should be one of the first names on McNamara's playing roster this winter. And talking of dirty tactics and I am not one for sticking up for Wigan but Louis Anderson, Gareth Carvell and Adrian Morley were far worse than what Tomkins came up with. Anderson should have been sin binned for that outrageously late challenge on Leuluai at the very least as should of Carvell for taking out Goulding was it????

Louis Anderson certainly isn't whiter that white but if he is just a thug what does that make Joel after his series of cheap shots last night?????

I like Joel and would love to have him playing for us. Outstanding player and still getting better. But he needs to cut the cheap shots out of his game. He is far too good a player than that.

i thought that, although it would appear joel had a good game as is standard for him this season, he seemed to just be out to give the biggest hits and show wire he can be a thug which IMO was one of our weak points last night. too many players trying too hard to show they were a big hard man when in recent games we've stuck to sound rugby and great tactics and plays.

if the incidents where the wire players "should" have been sin binned are anything to go by, joel would have been as well.

i felt he was a bit too hot headed last night.

I like his hot-headedness. Yeah, I know he's top of the SL penalty list, but I think the passion he brings to his game justifies that. A bit like Hock, really.

What concerned me more last night was those two uncharacteristic errors in attack - the pass to Goulding and the kick on. Most unlike him.

of course, i want all of our players to play with his "passion" but last night it tipped over the edge for joel IMO and just made the difference between a top performance and trying too hard meaning errors of judgement and silly penalty being conceded. his kick was very suprising, especially on the 1st tackle i think it would have been??? but whose to say a good pass would have given us any better of a chance in hindsight anyway (sob sob)

all in all a superb match, but wigan certainly lost it rather than wire getting a good win in. i know this is a joel thread but that first 25 minutes or so lost us the game, we should have punished them on the scoreboard much more.

Did know one see how our pack was being bullied and dominated in the first half last night?

We needed a class, experienced house out there. Joel did what he could, get off his back.

imo thats what weve been missing for a while.. someone who will rough the opposition up! cant wait for gaz hock to come back aswel!!!

there's no point having players who will rough up the opposition when in doing so they are giving away priceless field position and needless penalties and also running the risk of a yellow card. joel along with the rest of the team have performed more than well enough of late before the wire game last night without going over the top - that was my point. i'm not saying i don't want him to do things like that, i support it just as you do, but i'd like it to be in a more controlled manner as we've witnessed before last nights game.

no problems with teams having enforcers, we've got more than our fair share, and a bit of niggle isnt a bad thing, but it looked like JT was only willing to try it with the smaller players last night, (myler, mathers, briers) to be considered a real hard player he's gotta be prepared to wind up our big guys too.

talented player though.

look at it from the players point of view, big game atmosphere, local derby and on top of that warrington were giving it out just as much as we were. i think its abit too easy to say you'd like to see it more controlled when your not on the recieving end of a high shot or a late knee! not having a pop at you personally just saying i can understand why joel got involved in stuff like that

Look what Carvell tried to do to Tomkins in the first five minutes, if Wigan would've hada few more forwards to take it to your half backs last night you wouldn't have won the game.

Many Many times in the past Warrington have been undone by forwards sticking it to Briers, and it frustrates me know one does it more.

i understand the tactic and believe it's an effective one, but if you're gonna give it to the little uns, you need to be able to dish it out to the big boys too otherwise you'll get tagged as a flat track bully.