It does appear that way but it could just be that the times it does come off don’t make the news / rumours / forums.

The weird thing with all this supposed ‘too nice’ stuff by Lenagan and Rads is my partner worked for one of Lenagans companies for years and she certainly didn’t find him a soft touch and nor did the rest of the staff. She thinks he’s as hard faced as they come and people were on edge around him.

Maybe he rolls over because they’re rugby players and he admires them or maybe we just didn’t have an agreement that was worth the scrap of paper it was scribbled on.

100% I've heard that too.

On one of Catalans away trips I spent the weekend with the father and brother of an ex player and he said exactly the same thing.

True but obviously we can only deal with the ones we know about. I would certainly say that none of those (that I can think of) has gone our way. GW, getting what seems to be an easy release and now he's performing well for one of our main rivals. Likewise taking an injured Tomkins back on marquee money and getting a couple of sub standard seasons before he ups and leaves for the South if France. Bevan French getting extended leave and getting injured for the season as a consequence (according to Rads). I know there are probably 2 sides to those stories but, nevertheless, on the face of it we definitely didn't benefit from any of those for example.

The extended leave for French, let’s just agree it was acceptable because of the family situation.

What isn’t acceptable is:
1 - why he didn’t have a personal trainer out there
2 - why he wasn’t doing extra gym work
3 - why the club rushed him back? Is there someone at the club who doesn’t know what they are doing ? (Burgess injury, French, Field? Who else have we caused injury to).

Now points 1 and 2 is an assumption based on club saying he returned unfit.

Maybe his family situation didn't allow for him to spend time training?

Possibly but an hour a day at night or in the morning? I think that’s a more than reasonable ask personally. Clubs got to expect something back from French, otherwise it’s fully paid time off which is of no benefit to anyone but French and if that’s the case a huge precedent has been set.

I think you're being unfair to him. He came back unfit for a pro rugby player, he didn't come back grossly out if shape.

He probably did the hour etc, but that's a world away from a 8 - 12 weeks pre season in a pro environment.

I’m not criticising him or trying to be unfair, I know nothing about the situation back home and know full well from my own familial experiences that some things happen where literally no time can be made for anything other than being with/doing stuff for that family member. But other situations can warrant an hour at least a day.

I’ve worded it poorly so can see why you’d take that view.

The fact that talented players including Ratchford, Welsby, Williams etc no longer want to play for their own town club of Wigan is an indication of how the club has become a less attractive to some players not only from our own country buy also to some better players from down under and it comes as no surprise when other top clubs like Leeds, St Helens and Warrington all play in in brand new and regenerated Stadiums of their own.

Time that some supporters got off their high horse of arrogance and faced the fact that it is not only in the game of Rugby League where Wigan has now fallen behind nearby more progressive towns like St Helens and Warrington.

The rot except for the odd better season or so set in when the club left Central Park!

First of all, none of those you are aiming pot-shots at are responsible for that. The Gang of 4 have gone. Whelan and Mo have gone. All this was stitched up long before IL came on the scene. And none of the fans, even the 'arrogant' ones who 'ride on high horses' had any say in the matter and still don't.

Secondly, it's already been explained to us in painful detail why we can't have our own stadium at present. Even if we could afford one, the Council wouldn't let us. We would have to move outside of Wigan, which nobody wants.

Thirdly, I strongly doubt that the likes of Ratchford and Welsby (who I'm pretty sure was released by Wigan - it wasn't the other way round'), would only have played for us if we owned our own stadium. Seriously? Where on earth has that figment of imagination come from?

All the stars who have left us in recent years have left us to go to RU or the NRL. Not to Leeds, Saints or Warrington. GW came back to Warrington rather than us, but we all know why. They offered him a wage so ridiculously over what he's worth that he could hardly refuse.

The only way you're going to get what you seem to want - i.e. a stadium in Wigan that is purely for the use of Wigan RL - will be when Latics collapse. That may not be a long way off, but even if it happened next week, we'd then have to buy the DW ourselves, sell it and build another, smaller one. It's not going to happen overnight.

They were released by Wigan as youngsters. Ratchford wound up at Salford and Welsby (who I wasn’t aware was at Wigan once upon a time?) at Saints. There’s literally thousands of youth players Wigan have released over the years - me being one. Some went on to make Wigan regret it, others not. I don’t know what point you’re trying to prove here, what do you suggest we do? Keep hold of every youngster? Williams was never a Wigan player to sign. You’re picking and choosing players who didn’t sign for us, or who were actually RELEASED by the club to prove a point which is ludicrous - supposed world class players aren’t signing for Wigan because we don’t own a stadium, really? We’ve been in it for 22years and in that time we’ve signed;

Trent Barrett
Craig Smith
Brett Dallas
Steve Renouf
Paul Deacon
Stuart Fielden
Ryan Hoffman
Jeff Lima
Brett Finch
Jackson Hastings
George Burgess
Sam Tomkins
Mark Riddell
John Bateman

To name but a few. Jackson Hastings had a host of offers when leaving Salford, he signed for us. Bevan French hasn’t been short of suitors, he re-signed with us. Your argument has no basis whatsoever.

This “rot” isn’t really a rot seeing as we’ve won trophy after trophy and made final after final in the last 11years. I’ll take that kind of “rot” everyday of the week.

Keep wearing the blinkers!

Keep wearing the blinkers!

Alternatively, "I can't argue with a single one of the points you make, so I won't try."