I think most are going a little over the top here.

It doesn't look that bad to me and certainly looks a lot better than recent previous sides. Whilst admittedly a lot of that has to do with the influx of the Australian converts, it looks more competitive than years gone by to me.

Like I said on the VT, I would have had Brough, Robinson and Atkins over Lomax, Mcilorum and Ablett but apart from that not many complaints from me. I would have picked Mossop but he needs an operation. Other guys being suggested like Foster and Charnley aren't ready, possibly in Foster's case never will be.

Widdop has never played centre for his club, Sinfield/Mcillorum are both very average players, and I like Lomax but him + Chase are too similar.

The first XIII is decent, but the bench looks poor whetever way around we shape it. But I supposed with Burrow, Lockers, Joel, Bridge etc having withdrawn it does kind of leave it limited.

I suppose my main point is I don't see what JJB, Sinfield, Bailey and the like can bring that younger players of equal or more talent can't.

If Sinfield is playing 13 as Lockers is out, then I'd rather have Westerman. More physical presence, ball handling ability and is young enough to perhaps be able to up his game to at least compete internationally.

Your just not going to budge
are you?you gotta be pragmatic mate about what talent pool we got to fish from and on nt form this squad is bloody good given the injuries and limited players with EXPERIENCE(thinking of your england knights alternative).Look at the cack selections of the past that were absolutey dire but competed with BETTER oz teams than this JUST PUT IT IN PERPECTIVE A LITTLE AND SEE HOW MUCH BETTER IN TERMS OF QUALITY THIS TIME ROUND IT IS

Smith was very poor, all he did was pick all the Leeds and Saints players available, not realising that they didn't speak to each other!

CMON lol if lomax and chase hit form what we know they are capable of(please God fingers crossed)the ozzies will $hit bricks theyll have headaches how to contain em.Sinfield you cant NOT pick him especially on current form and hes the kicker of choice at present,jjb not my favourite but is an 80 minute bloke, INSIDE MAN OUR FORWARDS ARE BETTER THAN THE OTHERS this time we actually have quality running off our forwards our backline is not at all bad briscoe hall either wing im not complaining, dont forget mcnamara can swapwiddup and sam at FB releasing sam into the halves BLOODY HELL AS PAULINES PENS FAMOUSLY SAID"WE'VE GOT OPTIONS"..........BOTTOM LINE IF A BIG IF,ENGLAND DONT DO THEIR FAMOUS 10 MINUTES FALL ASLEEP WHILE THE OZZIES RATTLE UP 18 POINTS we can beat em keep the faith

Its not as bad as people are making out. If S Burgess, Flanders, and Burrow weren't injured and Tompkins wasn't off to union then McColorum, JJB, Wilkin and Ablett wouldn't have been in the squad. They're in as squad players because most of them can play in 2 or 3 positions to a good standard, and most likely only be in if injuries occur.

The only concern for me is the lack of an organising HB, which may mean Sinfield goes to loose to allow Widdop and Chase to take on the line.

Rat boy
Hall
Reed
Yeaman
Briscoe
Widdop
Chase
Graham
Roby
Peacock
Ellis
Westwood
Sinfield / Heightington

Morley
Carvell
Sinfield / Heightington
JJB

I know it would never happen but I would actually pay to see England RL vs England Knights.

1. Sam Tomkins vs Chris Riley
2. BJB vs Josh Charnley
3. Jack Reed vs Zak Hardaker
4. Kirk Yeaman vs Kris Welham
5. Ryan Hall vs Jamie Foster
6. Gareth Widdop vs Stefan Ratchford
7. Jonny Lomax vs Richie Myler
8. James Graham vs Lee Mossop
9. James Roby vs Scott Moore
10. Adrian Morley vs Ben Harrison
11. Gareth Ellis vs Liam Farrell
12. Ben Westwood vs James Donaldson
13. Chris Heightington vs Joe Westerman

14. Rangi Chase vs Matty Smith
15. Kevin Sinfield vs Paul Clough
16. Gareth Carvell vs Mike Cooper
17. Jamie Peacock vs Liam Watts

The England RL is obviously stronger on paper but each of those Knights play SL with or against the first team every week and there is some real quality in there.

It would most certainly be a competitive game! There's very little between some of the players on either side.

The Knights would get murdered in the forwards.

On paper Sam Burgess, Sean O' Loughlin and Rob Burrow would be in the England 17 if they were fit

not done bad McNamara up to now as he? loooooooool (to the pessimistic buggers posts pre 4nation)

He's done ok, if we get beat by the Aussies convincingly though it's same old same old.

That's the key. Tony Smith took us to the final in 2009. If McNamara can get this team to win the final then he'll have proven himself a cut above, as indeed will the team.

Thing is, I think this team is much better than the team from 2009, espoecially the backs. The likes of Chase and Tomkins have brought a different dimension and players like Hall and Briscoe are much improved. Not trying to take anything from McNamara, but he's basically got better players at his disposal than Tony Smith did IMO

I agree re the backs. I posted on here a few weeks ago that the 3/4s were awful and that we had only one world class back (Tomkins), which was just wrong. I am delighted to be proved wrong!

Hall has been very, very impressive and at the moment has a strong case for being considered the best winger in world rugby (either code). He is a big unit, skilful, quick and very strong.

The other 3/4s have performed better than I expected.

As for the other backs, Chase has been a bit of a disappointment but looked good against NZ. Sinfield - well, if you're a Leeds fan he's world class and if you're not then you want Widdop to be given a shot.

As for Tomkins, I've said repeatedly on this and other boards in the last few months that I think this lad could be as good as (and possibly even surpass) Hanley. And unlike with my comments on our 3/4s I am more and more confident that was the right call. If there's a more talented player in the tournament, I haven't seen him. At times he looks almost unplayable. I can't wait for next week. The Aussies will start big favourites but this is I think the weakest Aussie team for a while and who knows, with some magic from the likes of Tomkins and Hall and a lot of hard graft from our forwards we might just have a chance of sneaking a narrow win. Cutting out the errors and indiscipline will be crucial.