Excellent debate there about Smith. Some good points raised IMO and valid ones at that.

I’ll throw my 20p worth in about Smith. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again; I’d like to see Smith with a decent Head Coach and behind a good pack before I start calling for his departure. FWIW I agree in part with jonh that he certainly isn’t showing that promise or talent he was rapped to have. He hasn’t taken games by the scruff of the neck and has gone into hiding. For me he looks lost, he looks like he’s no idea what his coach wants him to do other than “Give it Hastings”. Perhaps he does need to be a little stronger and do things himself but you’ve got to remember he’s only really in his 2nd season at the top level and whilst HB’s need a commanding voice and confident strut about them, Smith has strong personalities taking over him.

Smithies, Partington and Byrne for me can go. I’ve seen enough. They all had promising starts but the more I watch them the more it’s obvious to see they’re nothing more than mid-lower SL standard. Players who have a dig but are in the main ineffective. Shorrocks has something about him I like but I’m leaning towards putting him in the aforementioned category to be honest.

It feels a little like scape goat hunting here. We all know the root cause of these issues - Adrian Lam

Probably right there. As I said last night, I'm not saying Smith is or isn't any good, I just want to see him behind a decent pack before I judge him.

Put any other half back in from SL in place of Smith and were still rubbish, we might be a little less rubbish who knows, but still rubbish.

Paul Sculthorpe comments (and I haven't wat hed it myself yet so taking the words on here as gospel) are exactly what I've been saying for pretty much 2 and 1/2 years.

Exactly, Dodds is playing at the back of a better pack and in a better all round squad than Smith.

To make comparisons of these two young and good players at the present time is nonsense!


And any adverse comments by Sculthorpe about Wigan might have more to do with him having a chip on his shoulder about his son being not being signed from the Academy rather than the game itself.

Barry McDermott is another as a result of being got rid of by the club.

Sculthorpe’s comments were respectful but damning. Big difference to him just gobbing off.

Swap Smith and Dodds last night and Smith wins man of the match and everyone raves about him. I thought he did ok last night as it was but no halfback is going to be able to play on the back of that absolute shambles of a front row and under this absolute shambles of a coach.

Good god almighty have you heard yourself? Sculthorpe’s comments are fuelled by his son being released?

And you have the sheer cheek to criticise the clubs running but won’t have criticism of the players or coach.

Hypocrite of the highest calibre.

Exactly

Have a position and make the facts (or in truth make up the facts) to suit that position
Despite it being hypocritical or contradictory and when facts are thrown back just ignore them

See, I'm not really convinced abut that. Obviously, Smith would benefit (a lot) from having a better squad around him and a better coach, but I don't think you can lay all the blame for his poor decisions, loose passes and wayward kicks on the catch-all "playing behind a beaten pack". I wouldn't write him off, he clearly has talent. It remains to be seen if another coach can make a top half out of him.

I’m absolutely convinced. Look how he player against Leigh, well that last night was as big a miss match the other way but we defend better than Leigh.

Smith will be fine if we get a better pack and a better coach to help him and the rest of the players. He’s in the eye of a storm at the minute and he’s struggling but Wigan back good young players and he’ll get what he needs in that regard.

Bang on I thought the same too you could almost see he wanted to just say “are they good enough”but held back for the reason you state,it’s about time the media started to cast its beady eye toward Wigan all too often they paper over the cracks and move on.

The criticism of the club and its players was spot on.

Apart from the obvious errors he makes it’s his attitude that for me is the biggest issue.

Dodds last night was very much the junior half in the Saints pairing. Lomax is a very dominant half.

Did Dodds sit back and let Lomax boss the show? No. He actually had a dig and looked to make things happen and tried, successfully at times to take the game by the scruff of the neck.

Smith seems all too happy letting Hastings boss it and just sitting back and playing a bit part.

I know of no quality half of any age that is comfortable just sitting back and hiding behind others.

Smith may well benefit from a new coach but I think he may benefit more from a new partner who is less dominant.

I’m not writing him off but I’m obviously not impressed so far. There needs to be a lot of improvement in his game fundamentals and his ability to manage and control a game.