An excellent summing up RG

Hanbury wasn't in his face. He was, understandably, celebrating Dean's try. The whole Wigan act is getting a bit old now really. Not saying Saints players are angels by any means, Wellens loves gobbing off at the referee, Travis Burns is probably the niggliest player in the league. The way Wigan play though isn't surprising when you've got players like Joel Tomkins, who couldn't deciede who to kick off with when Dean scored, coupled with the fact that Wane's lost the plot. It's rubbing off on the whole team, that kick out wasn't like Matty Smith and like people have said, Liam Farrell seems to have become braindead recently with his lying on in the tackle. It's been coached into the team and it's sad to see really.

Aggression is a great thing when channelled properly, but some players have it and some don't. O'Loughlin, Ellis, Westwood, Peacock etc. They have always played hard probably since they were 13 years old. But they do it the right way.

If you try to coach it into guys like Farrell, to whom it just doesn't come naturally, the result it what we are seeing now. Needless penalties and petulance.

It's clear that they have tried to coach aggression into Faz as if you remember a couple of seasons ago, Wane made a comment said that Faz was playing well but wasn't aggressive enough in the tackle. Now we see the results of him becoming more aggressive as more penalties are given away.

Quote Mr. Zucchini Head="Mr. Zucchini Head"Aggression is a great thing when channelled properly, but some players have it and some don't. O'Loughlin, Ellis, Westwood, Peacock etc. They have always played hard probably since they were 13 years old. But they do it the right way. If you try to coach it into guys like Farrell, to whom it just doesn't come naturally, the result it what we are seeing now. Needless penalties and petulance.'" Not disagreeing with you entirely but Farrell only gave away 1 penalty last night, and he should be fined for stupidity for doing it. www.superleague.co.uk/report/10950

Quote Mr. Zucchini Head="Mr. Zucchini Head"Aggression is a great thing when channelled properly, but some players have it and some don't. O'Loughlin, Ellis, Westwood, Peacock etc. They have always played hard probably since they were 13 years old. But they do it the right way. If you try to coach it into guys like Farrell, to whom it just doesn't come naturally, the result it what we are seeing now. Needless penalties and petulance.'" Not disagreeing with you entirely but Farrell only gave away 1 penalty last night, and he should be fined for stupidity for doing it. www.superleague.co.uk/report/10950

I never thought I would say this but I agree with all of that.

RG I agree under the laws of the game contact to the head should be Red card, however I think I'm right in thinking it says deliberate contact and as a few of the sky team pointed out last night that was not deliberate. Poor technique yes but not deliberate, yellow card and on report for me. But if it is contact to the head = red card how come when Logan Tomkins I think hit Mellor around the head in the 2nd half it was not a red nor a yellow? The way he swung his arm he was always going to hit the back of Mellors neck and then ride up onto his head, if Mellor was facing that swinging arm it would have hit him right across his throat and gone up into his face and the Sky team and everyone would have being going ballistic but apparently just because he had his back to it and it hit the back of his neck first it is deemed OK pen to Widnes? I bet if Ah Van's tackle is slowed right down his arm hits Charnley's shoulder a micro second before the hand or forearm hits his chin will that be taken into account as you read every week at the disciplinary 'hit shoulder, or arm or back before contact with head is made, sending off sufficient or 1 game etc.'.

Smiths kick out was deliberate and Tomkins running around looking for someone to hit was a joke, Smith should have been straight red and Tomkins possible red but defo a yellow but nothing. TJ then tells ref Smith has been berating him behind the sticks so he bins him for a bit of lip not assault?

But like you say there were more incidents that were so obvious that just was not picked up by the ref and his team it shocking. Sean O on the first tackle had the Widnes player around the throat and it was just ignored second half the ref defo did his best to even up the penalty count IMO some right some wrong. Unfortunately this is just something all teams will have to put up with as some of the refs have no idea what they are doing.

I will be amazed if Smith gets anything for the deliberate kick on Hanbury, provoked or not that is way out of line and like someone says if he did it earlier in the game then he should be punished even if just 1 match. I expect them to come out with picture doesn't really show enough to make a decision no case to answer, Tomkins will not even be cited. But Mellor probably will be even though it was O'Carroll who pushed (nothing in it) SO.

Great game for viewers to get the season underway, another easy one next week up at Headingly.

As a neutral I can't understand what has gotten into Matty Smith and Liam Farrell, they ought to get back to what they do best, skill moves not apprentice thugs.

Well the ref was a joke but for gods sake get real I was brought up to believe wigan were a team that played entertaining football , and that last night was a joke . Yes I am a Widnes fan , and proud to be one , but my old man taught me to appreciate quality on the field and he would have to admit that last night Wigan played like thugs rather than the quality ball players they once were and with a decent ref on the field who knows what could have happened .

Not a soft yellow in my book.
A ban of 1/2 games should come Smiths way.

And the same for Tomkins.
He pushed his own player our of the way in order to "tackle" the Widnes player who was celebrating their try.
Needless and idiotic.

Not quite right.
Hanbury celebrated and got in Smith's face (all fair enough. A bit of sledging is fine with me).
Smith kicks Hanbury who doesn't react and just mutters something and rightly walks off to celebrate with his team mates.
Joel, like a giddy school kid spoiling for a fight, is bouncing around towards Hanbury until he see's Phelps come jogging in to have a go at Smith for kicking out.
Tomkins then nails Phelps.
Result = Tomkins and Smith both act like petulant school children.
All a bit embarrassing from two senior players.