And I quote:

"3) that Wigan have more average players so losing them probably makes less difference to them than saints losing world class players like Walmsley"

Are you seriously trying to pretend that the implication there is anything other than Wigan have average players and Saints have World class?

If you'd said "a world class player like Walmsley" then you could claim the above. You said "world class players". Plural. Capeesh?

On Wigan you insinuate that losing players wouldn't impact as they are average. If you'd said "Wigan losing some of their lesser players wouldn't impact as much as losing their best ones" then you'd have been right. It would have also been stating the obvious.

I've accused you of being disingenuous several times now and you continue to prove me right whilst protesting your innocence. Utterly ridiculous!

So let's be honest here for a change, shall we? We both know exactly what you meant.

I think you might be under valuing Thompson’s performances a little tbh. I thought he was absolutely outstanding for those couple of seasons before his exit.

My eyes tell me Walmsley is a brilliant superleague player and I’m agreeing, I think he’s world class but until there’s concrete proof there, I can’t be sure he’d nail the NRL or that he will dismantle the Aussies, Kiwis, Tongans etc in the World Cup. He’s certainly not done that in the past for England but his game has improved since then.

The packs in superleague are chalk and cheese with the NRL and as a poster who has criticised the likes of Wigan, with Brad Singleton and there overrated, under sized forwards, I’m sure you’d agree the test he’s getting here isn’t always the greatest.

James Roby would be a good comparison as a guy who also hasn’t tested himself down under but we will all absolutely agree he was at one point as World Class as they come. The difference? A few things really. Some fabulous GB/England performances, the same with the WCC and he also terrorised a superleague twice as strong as the one Walmsley is chewing up.

I agree, and AW is walking all over them in the way you would expect a world class prop to.



Roby was clearly a world class hooker in his prime and I didn't need to see him in a WCC game or England shirt to know it - again, evidence of your own eyes regarding his relative superiority was sufficient - perfect distribution, great decision making, plays 80 minutes and mises about one tackle a year. In the same way AW is clearly a world class prop (IMO) - the Saints v Roosters WCC game in 2020 is a good one to look at if you need to - immense and he's been at that level for a few years now - but really it's not necessary because it's just so obvious.

Sorry mate, but no. Your implication is clear. Otherwise you would have compared Saints losing Walmsley to Wigan losing Field. That would have been a debate worth having

Look, I've said it before that I think you are a good poster and, along with Stu and YG (as long as he hasn't spent the morning on RedVee before coming on) your contributions add to this board. I know it isn't easy being the lone dissenting voices so I, and I know others, value that you post. It makes for more varied and interesting discussions. The Barba one was the best I've had on these boards in years. It just needed a nice pub and a few pints!


Just own what you say and stop trying to pretend you meant something else. If you feel Saints are world class and Wigan are garbage that's fine. Gives us something to argue about. I know that's not what you said before you correct me. I'm just making a point.

I'll go with all that but I'll ask you one more question when it comes to the difference in 'World Class' performances playing in Superleague and how they may or may not translate to the NRL or International rugby.

We know Roby could do it anywhere, so what's your thoughts on Sam Tomkins?

Now if we're looking for a guy who terrorised super league defences, here is your man. The guy was unstoppable for about 4 seasons between 2010-2013. Now consider he was doing that to far better teams than Walmsley is facing (a hugely strong Leeds team, a strong Saints team, a Wire team light years in front of where they are now etc) and he then went to the NRL. I thought he did pretty well and again the supposed struggles were exaggerated but I presume with Tomkins, you trusted you eyes before he went and said he was World Class and you didn't need any absolute evidence to the contrary?

And I'll add again 'I think Walmsley is World Class' but you're quick to say he is but Bateman isn't. It's a funny old game.

I personally think Walmsley is world class but I don't believe it can be claimed yet. There's a difference between "thinking" and "being". Being needs proof and we simply don't have that yet. I hope the proof comes in the world cup though.

I LITERALLY did do that! I said "It’s all very well talking about taking Walmsley out of saints but on this seasons evidence you’d struggle to score a point without field and against Catalans you didn’t with him (in a game everyone on here was saying was an acid test and payback for last year)." You just skimmed over it because you seem more obsessed with creating some sort of implication behind what I said rather than just reading it.

We're going round in circles mate. You LITERALLY didn't compare them in the post I was responding to. You also didn't say "our only world class player, Walmsley" or even "A world class player like Walmsley". I've quoted it just a couple of posts up. Deny it all you want, it's there in black and white. I'll leave that particular discussion there as it's going nowhere.

As for the actual thread discussion, you said we would miss our top players less than you would miss yours. Isn't that exactly what we've been saying?

Wow - this is hard work. You are meant to think I mean exactly what I said - that only AW is world class amongst these two sides. In the same way I'm not including Roby on the basis he was world class a few years ago, I'm not including Bateman on the basis that he was world class a few years ago. It's very simple

Maybe he will get back there, maybe he won't, maybe Knowles will, maybe he won't, maybe Dodd will, maybe he won't, maybe KPP will, maybe he won't. None of that changes that only AW is now.

Watch him got trampled on by Singleton on GF now

One thing we can both agree on

You said that maybe I thought you was speaking Chinese because I implied you’d said only Walmsley was World Class and not Bateman and then you come back implying only Walmsley is world class and not Bateman.

Did somebody say simple?!

I cant believe the amount of s***e in this thread. im glad the saints fans dont come on this forum much anymore