FORUMS > Wigan Warriors > Marquee Player Rule |
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Star | 1979 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Oct 2012 | 12 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jan 2018 | Jan 2018 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
68548_1368547004.jpg "Imagine there's no heaven, it's easy if you try
No hell below us, above us only pie"(John Ono Lennon born Wigan 1940):d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_68548.jpg |
|
| Quote: sergeant pepper "Watching all the fans of the bottom feeder clubs announcing this as the death of RL is making me smile.
Really hope this is the seismic shift that many on here have been waiting 10+ years for. At last the backwards, cap in hand have nots have been put in their place.
Now let's watch the big boys crack on at trying to get the sport back to where it should be.'"
Mrs Thatcher is smiling in her grave right now at your views and how you express them. Are you a Blue Meanie from Pepperland?
The problem with your view is that putting the 'have-nots' in their place, as you so charmingly put it, leads to a competition just like the Scottish Premier League. Let the market take over and it inevitably leads to monopoly. (Anyone fancy a bet on who will win the SPL next year? Is there any point in watching?)
That's fine if Wigan are in the Celtic role, but what if we end up like Rangers with Saints in the Celtic role?
The good thing about the salary cap is that the league is genuinely competitive. Hull KR have beaten both Saints and Wigan this season. Are you really interested in watching Rugby League dominated by just a few teams or are you interested in watching games that are competitive (which most - though not all - are)?
Even under the present system there are really only 4 potential winners (even if you count Wire!!!) - so it's not as though we are being hampered that much by the 'cap in hand' brigade. But at least we have an interesting competition, with the top 3 losing 14 games - about 30%- between them already, often to the 'bottom feeder clubs'
I loved watching us in the 80/90s, especially as I remember us in the second division, but in truth only Widnes really managed a sustained challenge. I reckon the game is far more enjoyable now, though I guess others will disagree.
Peace and Love!
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Player Coach | 3970 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Feb 2009 | 16 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Sep 2024 | Aug 2024 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
44075_1339364158.jpg What's the rumpus, Tom?
[quote="Pemps":1dso5atj]I can't confirm Bennett's exact words but I believe they were along the lines of "Strewth Ian, I wouldn't touch him with yours. He's a flammin' Gala". [/quote:1dso5atj]
[quote="Wigan Peer":1dso5atj]I keep my bin under 30mph to avoid fines... [/quote:1dso5atj]
[quote="MattyB":1dso5atj]you cant tell me they are all busting for a turd.
[/quote:1dso5atj]
Please see for me if she's wearing a coat so warm
To keep her from the howlin' winds.:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_44075.jpg |
|
| Quote: Aboveusonlypie "Mrs Thatcher is smiling in her grave right now at your views and how you express them. Are you a Blue Meanie from Pepperland?
The problem with your view is that putting the 'have-nots' in their place, as you so charmingly put it, leads to a competition just like the Scottish Premier League. Let the market take over and it inevitably leads to monopoly. (Anyone fancy a bet on who will win the SPL next year? Is there any point in watching?)
That's fine if Wigan are in the Celtic role, but what if we end up like Rangers with Saints in the Celtic role?
The good thing about the salary cap is that the league is genuinely competitive. Hull KR have beaten both Saints and Wigan this season. Are you really interested in watching Rugby League dominated by just a few teams or are you interested in watching games that are competitive (which most - though not all - are)?
Even under the present system there are really only 4 potential winners (even if you count Wire!!!) - so it's not as though we are being hampered that much by the 'cap in hand' brigade. But at least we have an interesting competition, with the top 3 losing 14 games - about 30%- between them already, often to the 'bottom feeder clubs'
I loved watching us in the 80/90s, especially as I remember us in the second division, but in truth only Widnes really managed a sustained challenge. I reckon the game is far more enjoyable now, though I guess others will disagree.
Peace and Love!
We are only talking about one player. Its not like we can just secure signings of the Harlem Globetrotters.
If anything, we will now have the ability to use the exception to play for a big player, without (necessarily) sacrificing the wages of junior players or other squad members. which is what happens under the current (previous?) system
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Player Coach | 15239 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Jan 2006 | 19 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Oct 2024 | Oct 2024 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
: |
|
| Quote: Aboveusonlypie "Mrs Thatcher is smiling in her grave right now at your views and how you express them. Are you a Blue Meanie from Pepperland?
The problem with your view is that putting the 'have-nots' in their place, as you so charmingly put it, leads to a competition just like the Scottish Premier League. Let the market take over and it inevitably leads to monopoly. (Anyone fancy a bet on who will win the SPL next year? Is there any point in watching?)
That's fine if Wigan are in the Celtic role, but what if we end up like Rangers with Saints in the Celtic role?
The good thing about the salary cap is that the league is genuinely competitive. Hull KR have beaten both Saints and Wigan this season. Are you really interested in watching Rugby League dominated by just a few teams or are you interested in watching games that are competitive (which most - though not all - are)?
Even under the present system there are really only 4 potential winners (even if you count Wire!!!) - so it's not as though we are being hampered that much by the 'cap in hand' brigade. But at least we have an interesting competition, with the top 3 losing 14 games - about 30%- between them already, often to the 'bottom feeder clubs'
I loved watching us in the 80/90s, especially as I remember us in the second division, but in truth only Widnes really managed a sustained challenge. I reckon the game is far more enjoyable now, though I guess others will disagree.
Peace and Love!
The problem is that dumbing us all down to the level of the lowest clubs is no solution if those lowest clubs aren't the only ones we're competing with. Unlike a few years ago, we're now in it with the RU and the NRL. Okay, competing at that level might be a bit of a lost cause, but as far as I can see their persistent poaching of our best talent has been a game-changer in the last few tears, and we need to try and respond. I'd also argue that all through the salary cap era, the game has continued to be dominated by a handful of clubs. It bewilders me that pro-cappers always argue as if this isn't the case.
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Board Member | 32342 | |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Oct 2002 | 22 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Oct 2024 | Sep 2024 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
3076_1671446335.jpg SAINTS THE ORIGINAL AND PERENNIAL CHEATS
For sale full Saints kit (circa 1989). Shirts in pristine condition, but shorts badly soiled.
For 27 - 0 you get a trophy
For 75 - 0 you get sod all.
Wigan had eight in a row
Saints have five in a row:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_3076.jpg |
|
| Whilst agreeing in principle with the ruling I would also have liked some of the tv money be ring fenced to ensure the return of U23 / reserve grade rugby. Catalan should be in that structure, but at present aren't.
At the Wigan v Catalan academy friendly game at Orrell I was speaking to Laurent Frayssinous.
He told me Catalan could not be admitted into the U19 academy competition because the majority of the Superleague clubs were not prepared to travel to France at that level, so most of the young French players were playing in the lower leagues and that their season ended in early May. As far as I'm aware only Leeds and Wigan have played in France, but I think Saints, Wigan and Leeds have hosted Catalan over here.
|
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Star | 3922 | |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Jan 2012 | 13 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Aug 2024 | Aug 2024 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
65656_1708941604.jpg [size=95:2obtgspq]23 LEAGUE TITLES[/size:2obtgspq]
[size=95:2obtgspq]21 CHALLENGE CUPS[/size:2obtgspq]
[size=95:2obtgspq]5 WORLD TITLES[/size:2obtgspq]
[b:2obtgspq][color=#FF0000:2obtgspq][size=100:2obtgspq]SAYS IT ALL REALLY[/size:2obtgspq][/color:2obtgspq][/b:2obtgspq]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_65656.jpg |
|
| Quote: Aboveusonlypie "
Mrs Thatcher is smiling in her grave right now at your views and how you express them. Are you a Blue Meanie from Pepperland?
The problem with your view is that putting the 'have-nots' in their place, as you so charmingly put it, leads to a competition just like the Scottish Premier League. Let the market take over and it inevitably leads to monopoly. (Anyone fancy a bet on who will win the SPL next year? Is there any point in watching?)
That's fine if Wigan are in the Celtic role, but what if we end up like Rangers with Saints in the Celtic role?
The good thing about the salary cap is that the league is genuinely competitive. Hull KR have beaten both Saints and Wigan this season. Are you really interested in watching Rugby League dominated by just a few teams or are you interested in watching games that are competitive (which most - though not all - are)?
Even under the present system there are really only 4 potential winners (even if you count Wire!!!) - so it's not as though we are being hampered that much by the 'cap in hand' brigade. But at least we have an interesting competition, with the top 3 losing 14 games - about 30%- between them already, often to the 'bottom feeder clubs'
I loved watching us in the 80/90s, especially as I remember us in the second division, but in truth only Widnes really managed a sustained challenge. I reckon the game is far more enjoyable now, though I guess others will disagree.
Peace and Love!
Just when we all thought it was safe to come out again the protector of the underclass is back.
ATEOTD it comes down to aspiration. If you want to shoot for the stars, and have the means to do it, then what's wrong with that?
I want to see a Wigan team that's crammed full of the best talent in the world. I want to see us go over to Aus as a force to be reckoned with. I want to see a Wigan side that's considered good enough to play games vs international touring sides. In short I want us to be the pinnacle of rugby in both codes.
Who are Wakey, Cas or you to say it's wrong to want that? No one should stop another for thinking big. If you want to think parochial then please feel free just don't keep the rest down there with you.
You can shout till you are blue in the face about a competitive league but it's just a fantasy based upon season in, season out reduction in the on the field product. Every sport and every league, including ours, has its big teams who generally clean up or share honours. Even in singles sports like Golf, Tennis, Snooker etc the major titles are shared between the few.
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Star | 1979 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Oct 2012 | 12 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jan 2018 | Jan 2018 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
68548_1368547004.jpg "Imagine there's no heaven, it's easy if you try
No hell below us, above us only pie"(John Ono Lennon born Wigan 1940):d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_68548.jpg |
|
| Quote: sergeant pepper "Just when we all thought it was safe to come out again the protector of the underclass is back.
ATEOTD it comes down to aspiration. If you want to shoot for the stars, and have the means to do it, then what's wrong with that?
I want to see a Wigan team that's crammed full of the best talent in the world. I want to see us go over to Aus as a force to be reckoned with. I want to see a Wigan side that's considered good enough to play games vs international touring sides. In short I want us to be the pinnacle of rugby in both codes.
Who are Wakey, Cas or you to say it's wrong to want that? No one should stop another for thinking big. If you want to think parochial then please feel free just don't keep the rest down there with you.
You can shout till you are blue in the face about a competitive league but it's just a fantasy based upon season in, season out reduction in the on the field product. Every sport and every league, including ours, has its big teams who generally clean up or share honours. Even in singles sports like Golf, Tennis, Snooker etc the major titles are shared between the few.'"
I suppose we just fundamentally disagree. I don't think it is ALL about aspiration at all, although that is certainly part of it.
I want Wigan to be the best in a competitive league where everyone has the chance to win it. How much more satisfying is that?
I want to enjoy watching Rugby League when the outcome is in doubt. If you want a monopoly as in the SPL or a duopoly as in Spain then I would suggest you would get pretty sick of it pretty quickly. One of the reasons I no longer watch professional football is that it is boring. The EPL pretty much mirrors what teams spend on transfers and wages. So the rich get richer as the Champions League admits only the most wealthy 4 or 5.
Obliterating the competition because you have more money and power than them is against genuine sporting principles.
Actually I'm not really against this slight change in the cap - it was your objectionable tone that prompted me to post.
|
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Player Coach | 15239 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Jan 2006 | 19 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Oct 2024 | Oct 2024 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
: |
|
| Quote: Aboveusonlypie "I suppose we just fundamentally disagree. I don't think it is ALL about aspiration at all, although that is certainly part of it.
I want Wigan to be the best in a competitive league where everyone has the chance to win it. How much more satisfying is that?
'"
But wouldn't it be even more satisfying if that situation was achieved by ALL clubs attempting to raise their game?
I moved towards supporting the salary cap after a couple of years, but since the NRL started cherry-picking as well as RU - and apparently the one they're lining up after Burgess is Bateman - I've been very worried that we're hamstringing ourselves with it.
I feel it's too easy for the lower-end clubs to just bask in the comfort zone of having upper-end clubs restricted by tight regulations. How does that give them any impetus to improve?
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Star | 776 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Jul 2011 | 13 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Nov 2015 | Oct 2015 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
: |
|
| Quote: Aboveusonlypie "Mrs Thatcher is smiling in her grave right now at your views and how you express them. Are you a Blue Meanie from Pepperland?
The problem with your view is that putting the 'have-nots' in their place, as you so charmingly put it, leads to a competition just like the Scottish Premier League. Let the market take over and it inevitably leads to monopoly. (Anyone fancy a bet on who will win the SPL next year? Is there any point in watching?)
That's fine if Wigan are in the Celtic role, but what if we end up like Rangers with Saints in the Celtic role?
The good thing about the salary cap is that the league is genuinely competitive. Hull KR have beaten both Saints and Wigan this season. Are you really interested in watching Rugby League dominated by just a few teams or are you interested in watching games that are competitive (which most - though not all - are)?
Even under the present system there are really only 4 potential winners (even if you count Wire!!!) - so it's not as though we are being hampered that much by the 'cap in hand' brigade. But at least we have an interesting competition, with the top 3 losing 14 games - about 30%- between them already, often to the 'bottom feeder clubs'
I loved watching us in the 80/90s, especially as I remember us in the second division, but in truth only Widnes really managed a sustained challenge. I reckon the game is far more enjoyable now, though I guess others will disagree.
Peace and Love!
If it was up to you we'd all be eating the proverbial scraps off the floor whilst every other sport progresses financially. Just so we can protect a couple of clubs that can barely generate income of any kind. GTF.
|
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Star | 1979 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Oct 2012 | 12 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jan 2018 | Jan 2018 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
68548_1368547004.jpg "Imagine there's no heaven, it's easy if you try
No hell below us, above us only pie"(John Ono Lennon born Wigan 1940):d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_68548.jpg |
|
| Quote: Bluenosewarrior "If it was up to you we'd all be eating the proverbial scraps off the floor whilst every other sport progresses financially. Just so we can protect a couple of clubs that can barely generate income of any kind. GTF.'"
Wrong. I'm not sure how you draw that conclusion from reading my posts. Why would I be against Super League generating money?
Sports can progress financially whilst still having ALL teams competitive. There are many examples of this - my favourite being Major League Baseball with 20 different winners since 1979 - and that in the land of the free as well. A chain is only as strong as its' weakest link my friend.
Be careful not to stereotype my views just because I would put the health of the overall game ahead of partisan interests.
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Star | 776 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Jul 2011 | 13 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Nov 2015 | Oct 2015 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
: |
|
| Quote: Aboveusonlypie "Wrong. I'm not sure how you draw that conclusion from reading my posts. Why would I be against Super League generating money?
Sports can progress financially whilst still having ALL teams competitive. There are many examples of this - my favourite being Major League Baseball with 20 different winners since 1979 - and that in the land of the free as well. A chain is only as strong as its' weakest link my friend.
Be careful not to stereotype my views just because I would put the health of the overall game ahead of partisan interests.'"
The problem with your MLB comparison is the amount of people that live in the USA and love the sport. We simply don't have those kind of numbers here. I understand your point of view, but I have to disagree. We will only attract more fans when we can put on show some of the best players in the world.
Take us for example, it is no coincidence that our attendances have decreased ever since Sam left. At the end of the day, fans want to see the best players.
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Star | 1003 | |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Aug 2011 | 13 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Sep 2024 | Aug 2024 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
62118_1550845628.png Everything [i:1c0rjla2]is [/i:1c0rjla2]Awesome:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_62118.png |
|
| Who on earth is SW looking at in Canada RU or American Poseball? Have I missed yet another memo? Or is he blowing smoke? (rlhttp://tinyurl.com/ph9vybwrl)
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Player Coach | 1735 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Sep 2007 | 17 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Mar 2023 | Oct 2022 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
: |
|
| Quote: CyberPieMan "Who on earth is SW looking at in Canada RU or American Poseball? Have I missed yet another memo? Or is he blowing smoke? (rlhttp://tinyurl.com/ph9vybwrl)'"
Odell Beckham Jr we can but dream.
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Player Coach | 7636 | |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Sep 2005 | 19 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Oct 2024 | Sep 2024 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
17555_1637667680.png Wigan RLFC:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_17555.png |
|
| Quote: CyberPieMan "Who on earth is SW looking at in Canada RU or American Poseball? Have I missed yet another memo? Or is he blowing smoke? (rlhttp://tinyurl.com/ph9vybwrl)'"
Jarryd Hayne
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Moderator | 14395 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Dec 2001 | 23 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
May 2024 | May 2022 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
26.jpg Last league derby at Central Park 5/9/1999: Wigan 28 St. Helens 20
Last league derby at Knowsley Road 2/4/2010: St. Helens 10 Wigan 18:26.jpg |
Moderator
|
| Quote: Aboveusonlypie "
The good thing about the salary cap is that the league is genuinely competitive. Hull KR have beaten both Saints and Wigan this season. '"
You don't attribute that to the salary cap do you? HKR have obviously decided to make a stab at getting up there with the big boys as witnessed by the signings they have made.
They also voted in favour of the marquee player rule.
With Koukash at Salford the number of clubs who are basically frightened of the need to find higher wages is down to four. Why Hudds are one I am not quite sure but they seem to be.
HKR have behaved the opposite of the four who voted against.
Unfortunately pro sport has always been about the clubs with the most money being the most successful but it goes further and because the NRL has so much more money than SL it is the more successful league which may be stating the obvious but it is and the best players gravitate to the best clubs and leagues.
So unless we do things like have a marquee player rule we are just going to lose the best players but ultimately even that is only going to get us so far. We need to raise the salary cap. We could have doubled it had the new Sky deal been restricted to the SL clubs but instead the RFL lives in the deluded world we can support 26 teams on various different levels of funding.
Sure if all our best players end up in the NRL you can still have competitive games. You can see competitive game watching Wigan St Pats but if you want to watch top class RL live, you have to pay for it. If you pay peanuts you get monkeys and people won't pay to watch dross even if every game finishes 12-10 or 20-18 or whatever.
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Star | 4747 | |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Jan 2015 | 10 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Oct 2024 | Oct 2024 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
73327_1685730441.jpg :d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_73327.jpg |
|
| I can understand aboveus's concerns, and a better and stronger Wigan side good enough to take on the Roosters and co would be a hollow victory if they only faced four competitive games a year. That said, I doubt the fairly modest change on the table now will have drastic effect one way or another. I don't know what others think, but I quite like seeing a few English players thriving in the NRL; the likes of Hodgson and the Burgess boys. But of course, if every top young talent like Budgie, Makinson, Bateman etc ended up there it would be a big worry.
|
|
|
|
|
|