You do know that the big news story in this country at the moment is "immigrants" crossing the channel, including the BBC videoing them struggle across in a boat?

What has this got to do with anything we've spoke about?

Are you just trying to get my opinion on a number of other issues to create more argument? We had a general election in December, we all looked at who we wanted to run the Country and what they promised to do if they did, we all voted in a booth anonymously so to not cause arguments or cause people to bully others into voting a certain way, what the general consensus on social media says Labour should have won by a landslide but they never, they got trounced, the silent majority spoke, make of that what you will.

I thought we were talking about racism? Is that not racism?

No. We are talking about the club siding with a group that some people deem political, therefore taking a political stance. To talk about would be derailing the thread to suit whatever agenda you've got.

You say we have never been as bad as either but worked harder to combat it

Whether Racism exists 50% or 10% in a country it still needs to be tackled, the amount is slightly irrelevant. We haven't done enough and need to work harder to get there - The silent majority as you call them in a later post prove that.

You then say :- If the stewards and Police shrugged their shoulders and let it carry on then I'd say we have a major problem, because it hasn't then it's a few idiots and you can't tarnish a whole group of people for a couple of idiots

This I find interesting

Isn't people raising awareness and highlighting issues not doing something about it? You say if the Stewards/Police stood by and let it happen it would be a problem, I agree, But you seem to what people to sit back and let it happen unless a Steward or a Policeman decide it's not fair game?
Evil wins when good men stand by and do nothing
Everyone needs to confront and challenge those with Racist or oppressive views - I see it all the time with the Armchair Facebook Racists and their Whataboutist responses, Why do immigrants live in Million pound mansions, why do immigrants get benefits of 100k a year and it's all BS to ignite the fear & anger in people to subvert their views.
Unfortunately it seems it's worked a lot better than I hoped it would and "The Silent Majority" as you put them, well a lot of them are in that bracket (That doesn't mean that EVERY person who voted a particular way or not is, just a larger % of them).

Earlier Mr Duck made noises about Kamala Harris only being appointed to gain Black/Womens votes.

She is a professor, and has been a lawyer for nearly 30 years
She was the first DA of Colour in America

I researched her about 6/9months ago when the Democratic party nominations started
Her track record in the Justice system is phenomenal - And if I were to list her achievements here I'd spend the whole of the day writing them out - It's astounding

Yet in one sweeping statement someone can say :-

"Even the Democrat Party in the USA have now jumped on the bandwagon by selecting for the first time ever, a black woman as running mate to their Presidential candidate in order to get votes from the black population.
But that's Politicians for you, will say or do anything at election time!"

Misogyny & Racism in one foul blow!

And that's how it goes, Gaslight/Deflect to maintain the Status Quo, and believe me, as someone who has spent a large proportion of the last 5 years looking into American politics it is Far worse over there.
But the rise of the "Silent Majority" and our governments pandering to the right to gain their votes (ERG/Brexit etc.) has seen our own countries Armchair/Facebook & Twitter racists Emboldened

Pretty much all of it, including the post on behaviour of those fans that were ejected at the Penrith game
because like it or not, most things in one way or another are political.

Peoples views on the NHS
Peoples views on Brexit
Peoples views on Covid
Peoples views on Racism
Peoples views on anything can be considered "Political" even sport/music etc.

As I said earlier, Some fans don't want politics to play a part in sport
Unfortunately Clubs/Teams/Players have their own views and as long as they aren't inciting violence/hate/oppression then that's up to them
Who they decide to take sponsorship from, who they decide to let into the ground, who they decide to clap & have pictures at the end of a game with (If teams were to say go and clap or have pics with fans that had been racist/homophobic then that in some way would be accepting that behaviour)

You have stated previously and sorry for Para phrasing that you "Won't be supporting/attending Wigan games because of the BLM/Kneeling"? (As I say not word for word but you get the gist?) Because it should just be about the sport.

Well flip it
What about those supporters who would feel annoyed if players/clubs didn't actively support these messages (Which whatever way anyone puts it are right, there is Racism, there is bigotry about Gender issues etc.)

What if players at a club or fans were targeted for being "Whatever". If fans/players stood by and did nothing because it's "Sport".
It's not just sport, it's a business, it's culture, it's community, it's everything

Some people seem happy to progress with Sport or whatever in the Status Quo as it doesn't affect them. Fine, but don't complain when others who it does affect or those who want to show support to those for people who are being affected do.

As a White Middle aged straight Healthy man (Cue Jokes from the usual suspects) I have very little to complain about
Unfortunately it seems a lot of people in my position but of all ages seem to resent not having something to complain about and don't like it that others do

Disability rights
Human rights
Womens rights
etc.

Nothing has been given, people have had to fight for them, to protest for them
The list is vast of people who at the time didn't conform to what was the current acceptance of protest levels and would have been labelled as thugs/terrorists etc.- Nelson Mandela probably one of the most prominent.
But history will look upon him kindly - others not so much

In one of your previous posts you said :-

"If the stewards and Police shrugged their shoulders and let it carry on then I'd say we have a major problem, because it hasn't then it's a few idiots and you can't tarnish a whole group of people for a couple of idiots."

Make sure you remember that when casting your opinions of other peoples/groups protests

Pretty much all of it, including the post on behaviour of those fans that were ejected at the Penrith game
because like it or not, most things in one way or another are political.

Peoples views on the NHS
Peoples views on Brexit
Peoples views on Covid
Peoples views on Racism
Peoples views on anything can be considered "Political" even sport/music etc.

As I said earlier, Some fans don't want politics to play a part in sport
Unfortunately Clubs/Teams/Players have their own views and as long as they aren't inciting violence/hate/oppression then that's up to them.

No, sorry, if its political they can stop using 'The Club' as a soap box in which to convey their 'opinion'. We can show we are not racist by not being racist, it's that simple. If they want to support any political or social cause then they can do it after the game in their own time.

Who they decide to take sponsorship from, who they decide to let into the ground, who they decide to clap & have pictures at the end of a game with (If teams were to say go and clap or have pics with fans that had been racist/homophobic then that in some way would be accepting that behaviour)

You have stated previously and sorry for Para phrasing that you "Won't be supporting/attending Wigan games because of the BLM/Kneeling"? (As I say not word for word but you get the gist?) Because it should just be about the sport.

I just want to watch rugby, I'm not bothered about whether the club or players think Tibet should be free, BBC licence should be free to over 75s or whether they think Jaffa Cakes are biscuits or cakes, I couldn't give a toss, have your own opinion in your own time and the club needs to stay out of it.

Well flip it
What about those supporters who would feel annoyed if players/clubs didn't actively support these messages (Which whatever way anyone puts it are right, there is Racism, there is bigotry about Gender issues etc.)

Absolute rubbish. You might have 2 social justice warriors demand to know the clubs thoughts on social or political issues but its a rugby club and needs to behave like one. Same with the players, just because they're good at rugby doesn't mean I want to know their views on social or political issues, I couldn't give a toss. The only people who would 'demand' to know what the clubs views on things are the type of people who are obsessed with gossip and celebrity non-sense, probably spend a fair chunk of their time on twitter talking about the latest outrage trend.

What if players at a club or fans were targeted for being "Whatever". If fans/players stood by and did nothing because it's "Sport".
It's not just sport, it's a business, it's culture, it's community, it's everything.

I get that, but I've never ever heard anything racist shouted or said on the terraces. I've heard a hell of a lot of 'Your mums you dad, your Dads your Mum, you're interbred, you Wigan scum'. Turn that on its head, imagine if they used the word Black instead of Wigan, is that less acceptable or the same? Genuine question, just playing devils advocate.


Some people seem happy to progress with Sport or whatever in the Status Quo as it doesn't affect them. Fine, but don't complain when others who it does affect or those who want to show support to those for people who are being affected do.

As a White Middle aged straight Healthy man (Cue Jokes from the usual suspects) I have very little to complain about
Unfortunately it seems a lot of people in my position but of all ages seem to resent not having something to complain about and don't like it that others do

Disability rights
Human rights
Womens rights
etc.

Nothing has been given, people have had to fight for them, to protest for them
The list is vast of people who at the time didn't conform to what was the current acceptance of protest levels and would have been labelled as thugs/terrorists etc.- Nelson Mandela probably one of the most prominent.
But history will look upon him kindly - others not so much

In one of your previous posts you said Make sure also that the people saying that racism is rife also are told that, that a few ignorant racists don't account for the majority of the population who on the whole are tolerant and not racist. A lot of work has been done in the last 30 years, we need to carry on on the same tracks rather than having a group come in and sow division and stir up trouble. There's a video on youtube about BLM starting a protest mainly white liberals marching through Englewood and the black residents there stop the protest and chase them off, the black community leaders say they have a good relationship with the police and don't want these outsiders coming in upsetting everyone and undoing the progress that had been made in the last few years, have a look for it.

Either way, its not the issue, the issue is the club should have stayed out of political or social issues. If the club start talking about 'how food banks have increased since 2015' then they become political and in my opinion are criticising the government even though its a fact.

The club has shown it is't racist by never being racist and can continue by not being racist. It's that simple. But by doing a token gesture it's like wearing a badge saying 'Not a racist', all that happens then is people who don't have one of those badges are deemed racist because they don't have a badge. The easy thing to do is stay out of social and political issues.


My issue isn't so much the cause at all, it's doing it on the pitch before a game. The polynesian players pray together 'after' a game in their own time, I'm a religious person but if they did it before the game then I'd be against it. If the club announced over the tannoy that we would say the Lords Prayer before a game I'd be against it.

I think his name was Shaun 'something', I heard it on Talk Radio.

Quote: Jukesays "I think they did - But I reckon Spike beat them to it ??? Think it was when Ted got found out for his Bingo scam by Jeffrey Fairbrother'" Going back to one of the most important things on this topic, you're correct: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z8PTecXgcyc On other matters, I'd just say is there a more snowflakey response to your team briefly kneeling against racism than saying "that's it, I'm done with the team and the sport"?

Quote: Jukesays "I think they did - But I reckon Spike beat them to it ??? Think it was when Ted got found out for his Bingo scam by Jeffrey Fairbrother'" Going back to one of the most important things on this topic, you're correct: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z8PTecXgcyc On other matters, I'd just say is there a more snowflakey response to your team briefly kneeling against racism than saying "that's it, I'm done with the team and the sport"?

Cowardice?
Wow!

Jaffa cakes are cakes