Yea not 100% we’d win however watching last night take the red card out Saints just did enough it looked like. They are a shadow of their former selves. They use to be relentless in defence and could make meters for fun. First time I’ve watched saints this year not sure if it’s a coaching issue or players but the older players look to be showing their age and the bench looked a little light, remind me of when we had young Byrne, smithies and Harvard in the bench. I’m sure they’ll get better as will

I agree we underestimate them at our peril. Saints will be thereabouts when it comes to handing the cups out.

Yes you are right Zig as they did hand out the GF cup and the WCC to us.

On a serious note St Helens will struggle again this year in my view but you can never write off the saints

Saints wouldn't have lost the game without the red card and I'd be very surprised if they weren't in the top 2 or 3 at the end of the year. However, it does feel like a few cracks have appeared over the last year.

Regan Grace leaves - they replace him with a Championship winger who hasn't really made an impact and an academy product who looks quite average. Waqa Blake looks unfit and uninterested although it is early. Paul Wellens doesn't look to be bringing as much as coach as Holbrook or Woolf did. Lomax and Makinson don't look the players they were.

There’s definitely a changing of the guard at St Helens but they are still a quality side and barring a disaster will be in the top 3 places this year and are genuine contenders for the title.

Some of these comments are coming across as arrogant and over confident. Any match against St Helens is going to be tough and can go either way.

Losing to Salford is no benchmark. They were winning comfortably and imo would have gone on to do so had Percival not tried to be big and hard instead of just making a tackle.

To whoever said they wouldn’t take a single St Helens player. I’d struggle to think of a team in the world that wouldn’t find a place for Welsby.

Where would you play him mate? On current form Field us a better Fullback and French a better Stand Off. He's quality, without a doubt, but he isn't playing well enough currently to force either of those two out of the Wigan side.

On a separate note he seems to have become scared of taking the ball on the full. What's happening with that? I've never noticed it in his play before. Surely it's not a deliberate tactic?

I know where would he play our current players in his position are better than Welsby,maybe on the subs bench

In all honesty who would we want from the Saints team and who would we drop to accommodate.

The Wigan players are doing a great job for Wigan and I wouldn’t swap many at all (not like you’d be given the choice) but I suspect their fans would say that about a lot of their guys as well. You’d probably need to ask a neutral to pick a combined side and I think it would be closer than any of our teams in terms of the number of Wigan players to Saints.

Many Saints fans used to say none of our lads would add anything to them and maybe that was their point as well (although a lot of them genuinely believed they just weren’t good enough) but clearly guys like Bateman, Faz, French etc would’ve walked in their side.

We’re happy with our lot, I get that and Saints are our biggest rivals. We’ve turned the tide and I think we’re a better side than them now and we have a better squad but I do still have massive respect for how good they are and I still think they’re a massive threat to the chances of further success for us.

Last point on Welsby, he’d get in our side comfortably. I’m not sure where but he’s versatile and could play anywhere. Controversial maybe but give me the option and I probably go Field at fulllback, Welsby at stand off and play French on the wing.