Christ Dave, I was merely surmising as to the rationale, it didn't warrant such a facetious comment. It's replies like yours there that makes internet boards an unpleasant place sometimes, worse when it comes from someone with a mod badge.

A rugby league player career is short lets face it most retire from top level rugbt around 33-35 years old (with the obvious exceptions). Hock has made one almighty mistake with his habit from a few years ago and has paid he price for it. He probably wants to look back on his career in 10 years time and say I didnt regret most of the things I did. And this opportunity will be too good to miss. He'll have better pay, better weather and playing in what is regarded as a better competition

I normally dont slag off the RFL but I will do now. Because they have pandered to the likes of Cas, Wakey, HKR and others they have weakend the competition. Clubs should be spending up to the cap now especially since it hasn't been increased since it's introduction. With the rate of inflation clubs should be spending up to the cap. Unfortunately clubs are not so something is flawed there. Also the knock on effect is that the quality is lacking.

Apologies if it came across a bit strong. I get fed up of hearing the excuses such as "well we got a big transfer fee" or " contracts are worthless" or "you'd do the same if you could get a 50% pay rise" etc etc.

I find all these kind of points equally irrelevant as what NickyKiss said above when he mentioned IL saying being approached for our players is flattering but ultimately what good is that when we have little quality left? I don't really give a toss if we can sell players for big fees or what sort of pay rise they can get if we end up with a low quality side and that seems to be what is happening. I want Wigan to assemble a high quality side and keep it together not be wondering which one of our star players is going to leave next before their contracts are up.

Maybe when IL speaks to Phil Wilkinson today he we quash the Hock rumour but even if he does I think the discussion is now broader than just him and people have woken up to the fact we really have lost too much quality in one go whether he stays or goes.

Anyway, once again apologies if I came across too strong.

We've had Jeff Lima move to South Sydney, Brett Finch and Thomas Leuluai opt to move to the NRL, we've got rumours of Gareth Hock leaving to the NRL, Harrison Hansen set to be poached by New Zealand Warriors, strong rumours of Lee Mossop going on a 'sabbatical' leave to the NRL. Coupled with the fact Union snapped up Joel Tomkins - a tremendous talent lost to the game - and inevitably we resign ourselves to losing our star player, our competition's flagship player Sam Tomkins to Union when we allow ourselves to bend over and let him speak to whoever the hell he wants next year. This flat out sucks.

Okay, critics will say Wigan have poached Blake Green and Scott Taylor from Hull KR, but just say that to yourself, Blake Green and Scott Taylor. Wigan's star signing next season is Blake Green. Without getting all the scapegoat, give him a chance, stop writing him off before he's kicked a ball spiel, I never imagined for a second we would see a halfback combination of Matty Smith and Blake Green at Wigan. All our best players appear to be leaving/left/retired without any like-for-like quality coming in. Sam Tomkins, George Carmont, Jeff Lima, Brett Finch, Thomas Leuluai, Gareth Hock, Harrison Hansen, Lee Mossop etc and who are we bringing in? Epalahame Lauaki, Anthony Gelling, Ben Flower, Gil Dudson, Scott Taylor, Matty Smith, Blake Green - it makes for horrible reading. Finally the RFL will have the even competition they've been looking for when we're on the same level as Wakefield, Salford, London and all them other rubbish little clubs.

What is the point in heavy investment in our youth setup, developing and nuturing these young RL players not just as a player but as men too, seeing them progress through our academy system, integrate them into the first team, establish themselves in the first team to eventually move up to England RL players to then see them as established players poached by Union or the NRL. And the only BS you hear in return is "well we got a substantial transfer fee" or "we'll develop another one" or "IMO -insert any young academy player- is going to be a better player anyway" - all ridiculous points to make. The transfer fee money is no use because we can't afford the salaries of a like-for-like replacement due to salary cap restraints i.e Blake Green (Brett Finch), Matty Smith (Thomas Leuluai), that young lad who people think will excel and replace the departed player will only end up being snapped again by the NRL/Union or might well just not be as good. I mean, will Wigan ever develop a player like Sam Tomkins in the next twenty years? Say the next ten years?

Yes this is a dummy spit and probably makes for a tremendous laugh for some of the trolls on here but that is sad in itself. The glee other supporters will get when the best players from our competition (Finch/Leuluai/Carmont/Lima - possibly Mossop/Hock/Hansen/Tomkins) are poached to another sport/competition and Super League, the product they are paying for, is worse off for it, but who cares as long as we can finally compete with Wigan.




Well said, IL is turning into a minge bag, it needs to be said. Comments to the effect of "we dont keep players who want to move away" is poor to say the least. If he is a 'business man' you would think he would be as shrewd about this as he is about making a profit at the club. All I have heard out of his pie hole has been "the club is making a profit" it's not difficult to see where his priorities are heading now.

If they want fans to commit to season tickets they are going to have to better than this, coupled with the play off system debacle and our lack of investment in playing staff a lot of Wigan fans have questioned a season ticket option this coming year.

I called for a club forum and had some correspondance from the club that they may do it early 2013 but IMO that is too late, nine players departed so far with rumours of more...

Not annoyed at Hock because it's fully understandable why he'd want to go, but it's just depressing that we can barely keep our good players.

Can't believe we've kept Pat Richards this long, at least there's that.

Sadly Richards may be one of the next batch of players away. He along with Hansen are out of contract at the end aren't they? And I'd guess teams will sniff around them both and the incentives to stay look minimul the way things are going. We have to also consider the distinct possibility that Tomkins and maybe Mossop will be going through the exit door at the end of 2013 as well which makes re-signings harder in a way.

The 2013 Rugby League World Cup in this country will be the death knell of the professional era

The 2015 Rugby Union World Cup in this country will show any class player where the future, organisation skills, public support, and money lies.

RIP RL ...it was great whilst it lasted

Totally agree 100%.

Completely true.

Good luck to Hock though, wish him all the best, he should definitely take the opportunity.

*IF* Nigel Wood remains in charge:

RL in the UK is probably finished as a major sport. In 10 years there'll be a top-flight Wigan-based RU team, maybe the bast@rd child of Sale and Wigan. Wigan RL will be a semi-pro club, along with all the others, feeding the RU team. Every few weeks we'll get a statement from the RFL telling us how great everything is to make us feel better.

I have faith though that enough people love the game that this won't happen. One way or another they'll eventually find a way to get him and the rest of the RFL to resign.

But it's more than that isn't it ?

What about Finch ? Hardly a 'marquee player' but a decent one, but we couldn't even hold onto him. Apparently he wanted to stay.

George Carmont now appears NOT to be retiring. So what was that all about ?

For decades, Wigan due to it's 'RL culture' has churned out players. Unlike anywhere else in the UK. Now if I have spotted that, so have other people.

Wigan, even though a small town, regularly pulls in the crowds, again due to the almost unique culture for Rugby League.

Again, this will have been noticed.

The above 2 points equal assets. Crowds and players production, both can equal money.

A 'business man' will look at his P&L sheet and use those two variables.

We all agree (well I hope that we do!) that RL is the finest spectator team sport in this country, if not the world. It certainly knocks kick and clap into a cocked hat. However why is Ra-Ra so popular? Well, that's because the mass media tell us so... The RFU have done a tremendous job in promoting what is a dull, tedius spectacle, into the glittering raz-mataz that it isn't. The inertia has built up over decades, and now is an unstoppable force.
What do we have to promote our game to the greater public ...? Ray B****y French, and similar joke presenters before him. Until we adopt a professional approach to marketing our wonderful game to the masses, we'll always be a 'comedy sport' in the eyes of most.
The RFL need to wake up and smell the coffee regarding marketing, and promotion.. to convice the country, nay the world, that RL is THE sport to watch and play....

I know... lets get Derren Brown is as RFL Chairman and head of media marketing

Why would Tomkins leave at the end of next year he is supposed to have 5 year deal with 2012 2013 2014 where he cant talk to NRL or RU so how can he go at end of 2013 ? Wigan just need to tell him hes staying and he should stay simple as or he will need to walk out on his deal. Sam is probably the reason other players leave as theres not enough money on the cap to pay the likes of hock, hansen and mossop what there worth because he is on about £200,000 more than the next player.

If I had the time & the energy I would have attempted something similar as a response, well done.