I wasn't dismissing it - just pointing out some problems. I don't agree that 7/8th should have a chance of top 4. This season that would have been Catalans and Widnes, who had no chance whatsoever. It's pretty difficult to move from 8th to 4th over just 7 weeks. Even if Widnes had won every game they'd have been nowhere near.

I do agree about the lop sided nature of the structure caused by Magic. If Cas had won their last game then they would have won the LLS. Playing Wakey at Magic as opposed to us playing Leeds or Saints playing Wire gave them an unfair advantage. In fact such an advantage could see someone drop out of the 8 altogether next season with potential relegation looming as a result.

Yeh I hate the current format of that MW for that exact reason. I think it's made worse by the fact that the fixtures are seemingly pulled from nowhere. They make sure the Hull derby is on then have two games featuring Wigan, Saints, Leeds and Warrington then the rest of the fixtures are pretty random. Huddersfield as last year's league leaders played relegation favourites Bradford at MW this season, how was that fair? They had the perfect opportunity to mix it up by changing to a new league structure, and there are several better options. It could have been the first game after the split when there's an uneven number of fixtures, it could have been two double headers for the CCQFs, a standalone 9's weekend - any of those would have been better than what we currently have. It's a brilliant concept but they need to give it more of a purpose and move away from the uneven league structure.

They'll be small again just like cup semi finals are. Wigan and Saint Helens couldn't sell out at Warrington a few years ago and that was before the increase in capacity.

Everyone will "save their money" for the final the week after.

That's a problem of the attitude of the fans who think like that. I understand picking and choosing when there's 4 potential playoff games in quick succession, but a one-off game that is must win to reach the GF, that should be the biggest game of the season excluding finals. Same with the CC semis. Too many fans seem to adopt the attitude of I've paid my £250 at the beginning of the season, bought my replica shirts and that's it. I know times are tough for many but RL is already excellent value and fans shouldn't be put off spending an extra £20 a few times a season to attend the biggest games.

...or even leave the replica shirt, just wear last season's and go to a few extra games instead. Either way the club gets the money but I'm sure they'd rather someone actually attend the game than sitting at home watching it on tele in their replica shirt.

(Personally I don't wear one - I'd look ridiculous, though I've bought plenty for kids, nephews, nieces etc)

Maybe we could go back to first past the post for a season and see how everyone likes it.

We can't do that.

The crap clubs would have nothing to play for.

All they have to ''play for'' at the moment is the opportunity to bend over against a title contender and get their botties smacked.

Avoiding relegation ought to be more than enough for crap teams to play for.

Saints v Cas 7548.

I was their this was untrue it seemed way more than 7k. As its pay on the door because season tickets don't cover the game its cash in hand. Therefore, fudge the figures and pay less to the tax man.

What! Are you suggesting Saints are deliberately engaged in fraud?

I think that we have established that around 4,000 ST holders wont attend, even if the price is slashed to pretty much nothing, and around 7,000 will attend, whatever the cost. As all 4 home clubs averaged roughly the same crowds regular season, and the crowds last weekend were approx. the same, this seems to be a trend across all clubs and not just Wigan.

However, little appears to be done to attract those who don't hold a ST, and this is where the RFL need to step in, making dirt cheap tickets available for everyone, not just those who can afford to stump up £250+ for a ST.

All play-off tickets should be £10 adults and £5 kids/OAPs next season, and if that doesn't get full houses, then they might as well give up and accept that the crowds will be low.

The argument there is you are then devaluing what should be the biggest games of the season just to get bums on seats. Too many RL fans won't attend games unless there are discounts involved. Many of last year's WC games were discounted and you always see CCF and GF tickets on Groupon/Wowcher for as little as £10. Prfetty much every ticket to get in every SL ground is under £25, and most are under £20. The structure of the competition, not the pricing of the tickets is where the problem lies IMO.

Season ticket holders at Wigan this year didn't really gain any incentives over the people who paid £3 for a Loyal 18 membership (or even got it free with tickets for the first game). Loyal 18 members got the half priced MW ticket and have received a £2 discount for every game this season, including playoffs. I've no problem with ST holders' loyalty being rewarded and them receiving perks that non-ST holders don't get, otherwise there's little point getting one.

Then you must have no problem in 7,000 crowds for playoff games, as borne out over the past 5-6 years.

I do, personally, and I've made that clear in several posts. I hate this structure, which is what I think is the main reason for the low crowds. Next season we'll have a one-off knock game as the the only playoff game that doesn't count on a ST. The crowds should be much better. The RFL have stuck with this format with few discounted tickets for 6 seasons now and the attedances have been appalling across the board. But they obviously feel that they would rather earn the revenue of 7/8/9k tickets at full price than they would 15k at a discounted price. I don't agree with it, but it's the way it has been.