I am old enough to remember when the opposition fans admired how we played and i for one was proud to hear that from fans who were a lot fairer than they are now. They still admire us now but hate us more.

In terms of a second row forward playing in the centres I'd say he's no better or worse than JT. Probably more consistent than JT though.

In just those terms id agree although id argue joel offers more across the field in meters and speed and involvement.

Ablett has settled better in to the centre position then Joel imo. He is a bigger threat close to the line and is defending better in the position in comparison to Joel Tomkins who I believe has done a reasonable job but at the same time has proved he's a second row.

IMO Joel runs too upright and doesn't have the footwork to really become as good at centre as he is at second row. When attacking close the line defenders can stand him upright because he doesn't go low and his footwork is too heavy. He is more of a threat from deep when we stretch teams and give him some space (with Wembley being a prime example) but he can do that just as well at second row.

Keep up the 40 threads a day averge central park forever and in a few years time youll be british rugby leagues number 1 contributer

Wait a minute....what you've just discribed about Joel good at running from deep and stretching teams is what a good centre does!!! Its a second rows job to attack close to the line with heavy feet!!! To say Joels got heavy feet is like saying Carl Abletts as good as Gareth Ellis like the boo boys are saying!!

I'd love you to point out where anyone said he was as good as Ellis.

I said he was a similar style player and that I could therefore see him having an NRL career. As a couple of your fans have pointed out his game would suit the style of play over there.

The fact that either Joel or Carl are playing centre highlights how the British game lacks quality in that position. FWIW I like Joel's extra pace and dynamic there but think Ablett defends the position a lot better. If they could be merged into one player they'd be pretty good in either position.

One word describes him for me, "solid". Nothing more, nothing less.

I would go with this. He has definitely improved as a player over the years but I would still say SR is his best position. He has had a good season and been one of Rhinos best players, but I think that says more about the season Leeds have had.

stands out in a poor team but doesnt make him any good

I think a good centre has good footwork which enables them to make room close to the line for themselves and their winger and Joel is struggling in that respect. The best centres in superleague over the past few years have been guys like Carmont, Gleeson and Gidley and all 3 are fantastic on their feet. They're (or where) a threat from deep now and again but they really earn their money in the oppositions 20m. I don't see Joel being able to develop that footwork but that isn't a problem as he's a top class 2nd rower and he should be moved back there.

As for Ablett he's made a better job of centre then Joel IMO but he's nowhere near international standard. He's a decent player at centre or second row whereas Joel is a decent centre but top class second row.

What a stupid post. He was standing out in a team winning three grand finals on the trot.

Granted, it is a poor team now, but let's not get blinkered and tar the player with the same brush. He hasn't just stood out this season.

The lad is a victim of his own abilities. He can play across the park as a backrower, loose, centre, or stand off. Because of this Leeds have used him due to injuries across those positions. Had he just been the loose he was through his junior days, just the backrower, or just the centre, he would be at the top of the game in either position.

how is what i said incorrect? hes been good this season therefore he ie standing out in a poor team (lets face it, Leeds haven't exactly been good this season)

btw, to say he will be at the top of the game in any position is laughable

decent, solid player. nothing more

Because he's been standing out for the last four seasons. Have Leeds been a poor team for the last four? That's why your post is incorrect. It is not just this season.

I didn't say any position either. I said backrow, loose or centre. Had he been used there settled in just the one of those positions then yes he would be at the top of the game in that position. The fact is, he hasn't, and his own ability to play various roles and Leeds shortage through injuries in those positions, has meant he has had to be used across the park. Which unfortunately for the lad also sacrificies his own aspirations.

Ah, English centres. My favourite hobby horse. We don't seem to produce any of the sort that really make space for their winger anymore. The best centres, in the classic mould, in Super League are all antipodeans. Comfortably our biggest problem in English RL.We produce a few "strike" centres, who run powerfully and can finish, but they generally lack the more subtle skills. Joel Tomkins and Carl Ablett (who is a better back-rower than you think IMO, but we'll agree to disagree there) are far from the worst English centres in SL, which, good RL players as they are (Joel could be a very top-drawer back-rower in my view), says bad things about the standard of centre we're producing.

I have some hopes for Kallum Watkins. He has some issues to iron out, but if he can work on those he has some craft and guile to his play, and very good hands at times. Him and that Evans kid at Wire seem to be the only players coming through that really play a classic centre's game. No idea why that is.