So if Wigan had won the 2020 grand final you woldn't be counting it?

Of course we would

Saints probably need a few things to fight for top spot next year.

1) At least one if not two outside backs with some genuine pace

2) Lewis Dodd to have a great off-season to help him get back to his early 2022 form

3) Put a stop to the downturn in Konrad Hurrell's attitude and fitness

4) A front rower to replace LMS

5) An attack-focused assistant coach

They certainly need a metre making winger who will take the ball up. Ritson isn't good enough and Bennison is a poor mans Jamie Foster which is some feat. Not a terrible player but not good enough for a top side and probably not even SL standard if i am honest. Top sides can carry weak links, history tells us this but Saints' best players are all coming to an end. If their replacements aren't at least like for like they will drop like a stone. Not fair on Wellens really, he has been dealt a bad hand and he is one of very few Saints connected people i have time for as he was a superb professional and a seemingly all round decent bloke.

A few years ago, Walmsley coming off the bench was frightening and he skittled everyone. Now he is completely innefective an whinges every time he is tackled. Dodd isn't anywhere near as good as we were told he was. Welsby is decent but nothing out of this world, he has a good step and isn't scared of a tackle. Makinson, Percival and Hurrell have become injury prone, that is slowing them down. I don't rate Knowles one bit, another weak link in a good side.

2 players i do rate highly are Sironen and Batchelor. Batchelors improvement has been incredible and could easily see him in the NRL. Probably a bit too late for Sironen to go back now but they have one hell of a build on. Clarke has been on a steady decline but how do you replace Roby? Prime Roby was the best hooker in the world. Yes i include the NRL top boys in that too. Still, delighted they got beat though, just hope we can seal our berth later. I am bricking it.

Bennison isn't a winger though he's a full back
As for Hurrell he's overweight now

What's going on with Hurrell? He was woeful in last week's reserves grand final.

Not finished yet but it's not been too bad a season for a team with a shockingly poor pack, just imagine if we had even one or two players who could scrape into the Saints squad

Gone over his maximum weight so Wellens dropped him

Maybe next year...........

This has made me smile,as for years we have had various Saints fans coming on here advising us how to fix our team and what we need to compete in finals and of course how crap we are and that only one player (Faz) would get in the Saints team as a bench player.
Now we are beginning to let them know why they are crap and what is required to improve.

I don't think there will be to much difference between the teams next year.
But we need to sort out dissiline out with bans Saints had players miss 23 games to Wigan's 12

Play a bit more like 'dirty Wigan' then

It depends who you recruit mate. As it stands there is parity in some positions but an absolute gulf in others. You could equate Welsby with Field and Makinson (if he recovers full fitness) with one of our wingers but there's currently a gulf in the 2nd wing spot. Percy is a good centre but again he doesn't play half the season and Hurrell is a "fat turnstile" as a poster on the Wire board put it. Up against Wardle (doesn't miss many and dream team member) and Keighran you're struggling there. You'll need a signing. Lomax has been misfiring this season but if he can regain some form next year he is quality. Better than French though? Sorry I don't see it. Did against Smith is a no contest I'm afraid.

In the forwards you're a little better. You're 2nd row in particular is as good but, minus Paasi your front row simply isn't. We have so much depth there next year that we could field 2 front rows that would compete against your best. You need a signing (possibly more than 1). Thinking Knowles and Mata'utia paper over the cracks is madness. Bell is good but only at loose forward. He's not even in the conversation wider out. Even so, I don't think he has anything on Smithies, providing we don't lose him if course!

Losing Roby is massive. Massive! It's equivalent to when we lost Farrell. I'm not convinced your giving it the gravitas it deserves.

I think we're better than you next year. Only my opinion of course and dependant on future signings.