FORUMS > Wigan Warriors > Saints away |
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| Quote: 100% Warrior "- I never questioned his defence at FB. I questioned it in general (And you want him to play in the halves a position with way more tackling)
- Yes he was (Please, go back and watch past games, you're way off)
- Because we haven’t played it at all this season so why would we start now by switching French to FB? (Because, as you're agreed our attack is stagnate).
- It doesn’t make sense to you. It does to me and others. That’s no slant on you or those who disagree either. (Wouldn't make sense to anyone who understands position play)
All in all I’ve raised a concern about his defence in general and that moving French to FB wouldn’t make a difference because we haven’t linked in the FB much this season, it seems to have disappeared from our play. Zak has stopped being the link man because we’ve stopped playing it like we did with Tomkins despite Zak being perfectly capable of being such. I don’t think French in the halves is the answer, I suggested it as a possibility to switch up our play.
In all likelihood neither will happen and French will continue to go on the bench and be under utilised. (French has consistently come on and played in the halves when we have fit wingers, and not been effective in the position you want him to play) '"
Added some quick responses in brackets after each post.
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| Quote: Last Son of Wigan "Added some quick responses in brackets after each post.'"
We’re just going to go round in a circle. Agree to disagree but agree that Lam will not change anything
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| Quote: 100% Warrior "We’re just going to go round in a circle. Agree to disagree but agree that Lam will not change anything
I agree there! He won't. But I have to say mate, there's a big difference between a modern day FB and 6. The 6 is the left edge play maker, he's there to put others through gaps and run the ship on the left edge.
The fb, and French can play the link, is an attacking weapon who's linking out the back a little further wide off the 6 and 7. French would enter the line around the back of the SR with a centre and winger out side of him; this is the area of attack to utilise French.
With this unreal pace, quick step and passing ability you want him attacking the edges scaring the hell out of the opposition 3/4 line. Don't waste him having him play as a play maker closer to the ruck, have him further out; this is where he's most effective on each edge.
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| Quote: Last Son of Wigan "I agree there! He won't. But I have to say mate, there's a big difference between a modern day FB and 6. The 6 is the left edge play maker, he's there to put others through gaps and run the ship on the left edge.
The fb, and French can play the link, is an attacking weapon who's linking out the back a little further wide off the 6 and 7. French would enter the line around the back of the SR with a centre and winger out side of him; this is the area of attack to utilise French.
With this unreal pace, quick step and passing ability you want him attacking the edges scaring the hell out of the opposition 3/4 line. Don't waste him having him play as a play maker closer to the ruck, have him further out; this is where he's most effective on each edge.'"
Running the risk of re-starting here
But.....I cannot fault your logic and rationale for moving French to FB. I’m just not convinced on shifting out Hardaker to centre or that we will play a style which will bring in the FB at this very late stage of the season. Therefore I think we’d be better served with his pace and hands in the halves at this stage. Either way we both know he’ll play the bench utility role on Friday and possibly the GF.
Wherever we play him we’ll not get the best out of him this season, that’s for 2020. Give him a full pre season, work on actually utilising the FB and who knows he could be our starting FB with Zak in the centres. Or he could be a starting HB alongside Hastings.
I’ll let you have the last word
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| Quote: 100% Warrior "Running the risk of re-starting here
Ok, let's keep it simple...do you think French has looked effective when coming on from the bench to play left pivot? (6).
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| Quote: Last Son of Wigan "Ok, let's keep it simple...do you think French has looked effective when coming on from the bench to play left pivot? (6).'"
He looked lively against Saints and got on the scoreboard. As for effective I wouldn’t say so. I realise that is in direct contradiction to my overall point but he was playing behind a beaten pack and a demoralised team. We could have brought on a prime Andy Gregory and he wouldn’t have made a difference.
I think the last time he played there was against Cas at home (correct me if I’m wrong). He did ok, can’t say it was special and I admittedly after that said we shouldn’t play him there. Again in direct contradiction of my general point of view but again IIRC he didn’t play long enough to make an impact or be effective.
IF (big if) he did get a shot at HB and it didn’t go well, I’d quite happily say so and be firmly be against him going there again, same as I would if he went FB. On balance he probably should get a shot at both HB and FB. The issue arises in where do you put Zak? In place of Gildart? Sarginson? I’m not sure I’d want to drop either of them nor would I want to take Zak out of the team. It’s a tough call.
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| Quote: 100% Warrior "He looked lively against Saints and got on the scoreboard. As for effective I wouldn’t say so. I realise that is in direct contradiction to my overall point but he was playing behind a beaten pack and a demoralised team. We could have brought on a prime Andy Gregory and he wouldn’t have made a difference.
I think the last time he played there was against Cas at home (correct me if I’m wrong). He did ok, can’t say it was special and I admittedly after that said we shouldn’t play him there. Again in direct contradiction of my general point of view but again IIRC he didn’t play long enough to make an impact or be effective.
IF (big if) he did get a shot at HB and it didn’t go well, I’d quite happily say so and be firmly be against him going there again, same as I would if he went FB. On balance he probably should get a shot at both HB and FB. The issue arises in where do you put Zak? In place of Gildart? Sarginson? I’m not sure I’d want to drop either of them nor would I want to take Zak out of the team. It’s a tough call.'"
I do see your point. But I feel he's been tried and tested for this season as a half in the most critical time of year. As a fb he's not guiding us around the park but playing off the back of two experienced halves in our structure as a strike weapon in a position he's familiar with. He's actually played far more games as a FB than half.
I have to be careful what I say as I think Zak is a great player, and I would always have him on the pitch. For me, for a trial, I'd play him at centre or even on the wing.
All I'm campaigning for his for French to be given a shot at FB. I don't think for this season, we're getting the best out of French at 6.
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| Quote: Last Son of Wigan "I do see your point. But I feel he's been tried and tested for this season as a half in the most critical time of year. As a fb he's not guiding us around the park but playing off the back of two experienced halves in our structure as a strike weapon in a position he's familiar with. He's actually played far more games as a FB than half.
I have to be careful what I say as I think Zak is a great player, and I would always have him on the pitch. For me, for a trial, I'd play him at centre or even on the wing.
All I'm campaigning for his for French to be given a shot at FB. I don't think for this season, we're getting the best out of French at 6.'"
As I yours. It’s hypothetical really as to whether we’d get the best out of him at FB, HB or wing, though I do take the point that he’s had his chance in the latter two.
It’s a tough call to make, it’s giving me a headache so I feel for Adrian Lam! But unfortunately we both know it’s going to be Zak at FB, Tommy in the halves and Powell at hooker with French on the bench satisfying neither of us and not changing one iota about the attack.
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| Quote: 100% Warrior "As I yours. It’s hypothetical really as to whether we’d get the best out of him at FB, HB or wing, though I do take the point that he’s had his chance in the latter two.
It’s a tough call to make, it’s giving me a headache so I feel for Adrian Lam! But unfortunately we both know it’s going to be Zak at FB, Tommy in the halves and Powell at hooker with French on the bench satisfying neither of us and not changing one iota about the attack.'"
You're right mate. I don't think Lam will make any changes to the team that was hammered by Saints. Think he already said he wants to give them the chance to redeeM. Which to me says Lam thought it was an attitude problem, not tactics or ability. I find this baffling, if this is the case; there's something seriously wrong if players can't get up for a game which sees us play our local rivals where if we win, we book our place in the GF.
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| Quote: Last Son of Wigan "You're right mate. I don't think Lam will make any changes to the team that was hammered by Saints. Think he already said he wants to give them the chance to redeeM. Which to me says Lam thought it was an attitude problem, not tactics or ability. I find this baffling, if this is the case; there's something seriously wrong if players can't get up for a game which sees us play our local rivals where if we win, we book our place in the GF.'"
Me and you both. If the players can’t get up for any game v Saints there’s something seriously wrong!
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| We simply don't have the right type of half to partner French this year. To start him there would be very risky at best.
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| LSOW;
French went to HB. French did nothing at HB. Finally puts my argument to bed. Happy to go along with him at FB!
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| French has to be at fullback next year, Zak go centre, Zak has lost a fair amount of pace and his linking play isn’t good enough
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| Quote: KingRoss11 "French has to be at fullback next year, Zak go centre, Zak has lost a fair amount of pace and his linking play isn’t good enough'"
I’m inclined to agree from my position if disagreeing a mere 24hrs ago. But this now for me brings in a whole new debate; where was the sense in signing Bibby? We’re stocked for both wingers and centres (assuming for a moment Zak goes to centre).
For the avoidance of doubt I’m not saying I don’t want Bibby at the club, I’m just questioning the sense in his signing.
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| Quote: 100% Warrior "I’m inclined to agree from my position if disagreeing a mere 24hrs ago. But this now for me brings in a whole new debate; where was the sense in signing Bibby? We’re stocked for both wingers and centres (assuming for a moment Zak goes to centre).
For the avoidance of doubt I’m not saying I don’t want Bibby at the club, I’m just questioning the sense in his signing.'"
The Bibby and Clark signings were always strange ones, Clark now I’d give him game time ahead of Flower Clubb and Navarette, but Bibby will probably spend the first few games in the reserves but he’s a good player tbf, I’d be inclined to let Hankinson leave simply because French should be at 1 with Zak at 3 and Bibby backup
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