FORUMS > Wigan Warriors > Next up......Leeds |
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| Quote: Bigredwarrior "Ok let’s go back to the start of this little debate.
Unless I’m completely missing your point (which I’m not) [iyour position is that a player (Powell, Leuluai or Williams) who contributed towards the winning run and culminated in a GF win should not be ‘dropped’ in favour of a player (Sammut) who was signed from a championship club.[/i That’s a reasonable point of view and one I agree with to a point.
However, the exact same situation applies to Tautai. He played a big part in the run to the GF yet hasn’t featured so far because a player from the championship (Bullock) has been selected instead. Bullock has been far more effective than Tautai was in the run to the GF and not many people would put Tautai in the 17 ahead of him.
My point throughout the debate is that in much the same way as Bullock has, Sammut needs to be given a chance to prove himself. Nothing more, nothing less. If that’s me being Mr Predictable then I’m ok with that.
Rather than put words in your mouth, I’ll ask your view on whether or not Bullock should have been given a game ahead of Tautai, given his contribution to the winning run and GF success? I think he should because he has shown in preseason and friendlies to offer more. I believe the same to be true about Sammut who had a decent game, particularly kicking wise against Salford.'"
PS you did miss my point... and once again you tried to put words in my mouth.... shocking Bigred
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| Quote: Last Son of Wigan "I'm pro-winning. I'm pro rewarding players who consistently play their part in a winning team. I want Sammut to be a success at Wigan, but like I said in my original post which kicked all this off, he should earn his place, not leapfrogging players who are part of a winning side. If we weren't winning I'd suggest experimenting with our squad to generate winning performances, be we have that.
You keep trying to bring up kicking, like it's a justification for including Sammut, when it's so basic, such a surface level comment, when you look a little deeper there's a number of factors to why a player is selected, and currently we're selecting a winning team.
Imagine if I'd have asked 6 months of we're all in favour of signing Sammut and playing him in our halves, what do you think the response would have been?'"
His kicking capabilities and hopefully his organisational skills are exactly why I think when fit that Sammut will start on a regular basis unless his form indicates that he isn't up to SL level.
As a club and the game in general kicking from hand seems to have little focus or emphasis in period when territorial advantage is a major prerequisite of being able to dominate a game. If I could pick any player in world rugby today without a shadow of a doubt it would be Owen Farrell who in my opinion could transform the sport as we know I particularly in SL.
Last year's successful team had Sam Tomkins in and without him our balance has totally changed hence why I think we have signed Sammut because non of current halves has a reasonable kicking game in his nal. I hope that Harry Smith will develop quickly and that Sammut is very much a stop gap.
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| Quote: Itchy Arsenal "His kicking capabilities and hopefully his organisational skills are exactly why I think when fit that Sammut will start on a regular basis unless his form indicates that he isn't up to SL level.
As a club and the game in general kicking from hand seems to have little focus or emphasis in period when territorial advantage is a major prerequisite of being able to dominate a game. If I could pick any player in world rugby today without a shadow of a doubt it would be Owen Farrell who in my opinion could transform the sport as we know I particularly in SL.
Last year's successful team had Sam Tomkins in and without him our balance has totally changed hence why I think we have signed Sammut because non of current halves has a reasonable kicking game in his nal. I hope that Harry Smith will develop quickly and that Sammut is very much a stop gap.'"
If you could pick anyone in world rugby you'd pick Owen Farrell?
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| Quote: Last Son of Wigan "You're dying for me to go back and forth with you on this aren't you...
Are you saying that last season Tautai contributed as much as Tommy, Powell and Williams to our success? I'm merely sticking to you comparisons for clarity. You seem to look at things on a very surface level basis, without looking at the details of the discussion.
It seems, as you previously posted you think the Bullock/Sammut situation is exactly the same, when it's really not.'"
I’m really not dying for you to do anything! This is a discussion board if I remember correctly and we were discussing!
You do like to make things into personal arguments though and I’ll never get drawn into that. I’ll end my part in this discussion with the belief that in your mind, it’s one rule for one (Tautai / Bullock) and another rule for another (Powell / Sammut) as you simply don’t like the signing of Sammut. Enjoy your day.
Oh, we agree about Owen Farrell though!!
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| Quote: Bigredwarrior "I’m really not dying for you to do anything! This is a discussion board if I remember correctly and we were discussing!
You do like to make things into personal arguments though and I’ll never get drawn into that. I’ll end my part in this discussion with the belief that in your mind, it’s one rule for one (Tautai / Bullock) and another rule for another (Powell / Sammut) as you simply don’t like the signing of Sammut. Enjoy your day.
I'm literally trying to avoid an argument with you.
I see the discussed Tautai v Bullock very differently as the Powell/Tommy/George v Sammut debate. Are you saying that because they both come from lower league competition they are the same? That's merely one very basic factor.
Anyway, I do hope Sammut gets his chance, but hopefully not at the expense of the 3 discussed, who I felt were crucial in why we won the GF.
PS Tautai didn't even play in the GF. Front rowers were Sutton, Nav, Clubb and Flower, so that ends that.
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| Quote: Last Son of Wigan "I'm literally trying to avoid an argument with you.
I see the discussed Tautai v Bullock very differently as the Powell/Tommy/George v Sammut debate. Are you saying that because they both come from lower league competition they are the same? That's merely one very basic factor.
Anyway, I do hope Sammut gets his chance, but hopefully not at the expense of the 3 discussed, who I felt were crucial in why we won the GF.
PS Tautai didn't even play in the GF. Front rowers were Sutton, Nav, Clubb and Flower, so that ends that.'"
Wow you’re like a tramp on a kipper! I’m well aware that TT didn’t play in the GF but your whole ‘can’t drop Powell, Williams or Leuluai’ argument was based on the unbeaten run in the Super 8s, not just the GF so it’s far from ‘that ends that!
I’ll not be commenting on this thread again as it’s clear you like to have the last word so be my guest..... I’ll be the one sat on the edge of my seat waiting for the not so whitty ‘so ner ner ner ner’ remark.
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| Quote: Bigredwarrior "Wow you’re like a tramp on a kipper! I’m well aware that TT didn’t play in the GF but your whole ‘can’t drop Powell, Williams or Leuluai’ argument was based on the unbeaten run in the Super 8s, not just the GF so it’s far from ‘that ends that!
I’ll not be commenting on this thread again as it’s clear you like to have the last word so be my guest..... I’ll be the one sat on the edge of my seat waiting for the not so whitty ‘so ner ner ner ner’ remark.'"
Aww... please don't cry bigredender, it'll be ok.
And now back to the rugby. Roll it back a few posts. Pretty sure I'd roll out the red carpet for Cronk etc, remember? If anything Bullock has replaced Sutton.
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| Quote: Last Son of Wigan "]Aww... please don't cry bigredender, it'll be ok.
And now back to the rugby. Roll it back a few posts. Pretty sure I'd roll out the red carpet for Cronk etc, remember? If anything Bullock has replaced Sutton.'" ]
You really can't help yourself can you? Shame really because you do make some valid points and generally add to discussions.
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| Quote: Phuzzy "You really can't help yourself can you? Shame really because you do make some valid points and generally add to discussions.'"
Thanks for the compliment Phil, I'll take it. And happy valentines day to you too.
I'm sure Bigred knows it was a joke. He's pretty good to go back and forth with.
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| Quote: Last Son of Wigan "If you could pick anyone in world rugby you'd pick Owen Farrell?'"
Who in the UK has a bigger profile in rugby than Owen Farrell?? Outside of the M62 corridor nobody could name any NRL player irrespective of his standing in Australia.
If I'd a choice of any NRL player or Farrell I'd take Farrell in a heartbeat. He is class and a pretty tough guy to boot and I'd love to see him in the 13 shirt at Wigan. He is a quality player in Union but I think that his style of play and his aggressiveness make him an ideal player for RL. Commercially and technically Farrell would in my opinion be a true superstar in RL.
Tedesco is pretty handy but in terms of attracting new spectators I'm pretty confident that he'd get nowhere near what Farrell would do.
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| Quote: Itchy Arsenal "Who in the UK has a bigger profile in rugby than Owen Farrell?? Outside of the M62 corridor nobody could name any NRL player irrespective of his standing in Australia.
If I'd a choice of any NRL player or Farrell I'd take Farrell in a heartbeat. He is class and a pretty tough guy to boot and I'd love to see him in the 13 shirt at Wigan. He is a quality player in Union but I think that his style of play and his aggressiveness make him an ideal player for RL. Commercially and technically Farrell would in my opinion be a true superstar in RL.
Tedesco is pretty handy but in terms of attracting new spectators I'm pretty confident that he'd get nowhere near what Farrell would do.'"
I wouldn't pick a player just cos of their profile. I'd pick him on ability if I could literally pick anyone in world rugby. If even though I do believe Owen could be a success in league, if I was picking right this moment, I'd pick a RL player to play RL, I can't honestly say how good Owen would be at league.
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| Quote: Last Son of Wigan "I wouldn't pick a player just cos of their profile. I'd pick him on ability if I could literally pick anyone in world rugby. If even though I do believe Owen could be a success in league, if I was picking right this moment, I'd pick a RL player to play RL, I can't honestly say how good Owen would be at league.'"
Neither could I but you could say the same about any player from the NRL. For every success story of an Aussie or Kiwi there are tenfold who just add zero impact to the sport when they play over here.
Farrell would be a guaranteed commercial success and I honestly believe he would also be a superstar player. I'm not a great Union fan but I do enjoy watching Farrell on how he organises the game with great technical skills and generally with great composure.
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| Quote: Itchy Arsenal "Neither could I but you could say the same about any player from the NRL. For every success story of an Aussie or Kiwi there are tenfold who just add zero impact to the sport when they play over here.
Farrell would be a guaranteed commercial success and I honestly believe he would also be a superstar player. I'm not a great Union fan but I do enjoy watching Farrell on how he organises the game with great technical skills and generally with great composure.'"
I wouldn't be signing a player for commercial success. I'd be signing who I believe to the best RL player in the world, simple really. Will it work out? Who knows, hypotheticals, could ask the same question of any new signing.
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| Quote: Last Son of Wigan "I wouldn't be signing a player for commercial success. I'd be signing who I believe to the best RL player in the world, simple really. Will it work out? Who knows, hypotheticals, could ask the same question of any new signing.'"
If you would only sign RL players then historically we never have signed Boston, Inga, Botica, Flower etc. Widnes would never have signed Offiah.
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| Quote: Itchy Arsenal "If you would only sign RL players then historically we never have signed Boston, Inga, Botica, Flower etc. Widnes would never have signed Offiah.'"
Doesn't mean right now I should now pick a rugby union player if I had one pick, just because there's been great converts in the past.
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