If only we had matty Lee's 9 Carrie's 44 mtrs
If only we had Kyle amors 7 Carrie's 40mtrs, or his 25 tackles with 5 misses
If only we had LMS 7 carries 45mtrs and 7 missed tackles (he would be a good replacement, hes been saints chief back slapped for years).

Suppose well just have to make do

You're missing the point - I'm not saying the Saints pack was good, they weren't. I'm just saying the Singleton love in appears to be based arround laughing at a winger because there was very little else to mention and there are arguments to say he was the least effective forward on the pitch.

By the way - you should learn the difference between marker tackles and missed tackles in the stats as it might help your point next time

He certainly did a lot of shouting in between getting hammered carrying the ball nowhere.

The guys who led the win up front for Wigan were Farrell (56 tackles without missing a single one and making strong yards - brilliant performance), Powell, Bullock and Greenwood plus Smithies with some good aggressive but effective defence.

Singleton and Clubb the least effective of the Wigan forwards IMO - they were simply on the winning side.

All correct statistically

We can sit here and argue the toss all day but ultimately it really doesn’t matter. You weren’t the guy who said 3 Wigan players would make a combined 17 (what did become of that chap?!) and it is that which kicked up a debate. One statistic mattered on the night, just as it will in the next meeting.

A bit like Lees then

A bit yeah. Slightly worse workrate, no busts, fewer tackles and more misses and less yardage, but a bit like him.

Both were ineffective I agree, just Brad more so.

I agree with your summation except for one part which I'll come to in a minute. You may remember that my take on the discussion was not so much with regards to Singleton but that you objected to his inclusion by raising us an Amor and an LMS! You may also remember that I said that you did that without mentioning Bullock who would be the best prop on the field in the absence of Walmsley. Glad you have ammended that in your latest posts.

I agree Farrell was immense. That's no surprise to us Wigan fans and I'm constantly disappointed that fans of other clubs seem reluctant to see it. Again kudos for being in a ridiculously small minority on that score.

The one point I would dispute with you is regard to the effect of the Wigan aggression on your team. I saw over on Redvee someone posted on the Singleton getting in Grace's face incident that it had no effect. What game was he watching?!? The pressure on Grace caused him to fall apart as it usually does. What you call unforced or sloppy errors were a direct result of too many of your team being unable to handle pressure. We've seen it time and again, notably against Wire in recent seasons. To reduce a performance to stats sometimes misses the underlying truth and, in Singleton's case, this is very much a case in point. He brings something to the Wigan team that goes beyond metres per carry. Ask any Wigan fan and they'll tell you that the difference in our pack since his arrival has been marked.

Did Grace really fall apart because of Singleton? Singleton had zero influence on his error from the drop-out - he was just there shouting after it happened! And I might be wrong but wasn't that the second of his two errors?

And even if Grave made his second error after that - do you think his confidence was hit more by his first error or Singleton playing the hard man? Linking Grace "falling apart" to Singleton just because Singleton shouted in his direction after he'd already "fallen apart" is just daft. You might as well say Singleton made his error because he was intimidated by getting smashed every time he took the ball in, which I also don't think is true.

Anyway - I'm not sure anyone is going to agree with me about his performance so I'll leave it there and look forward to next time.

Is exactly the point with Singleton. He has lifted the whole place and there isn’t a stat for that. I wouldn’t expect a Saints fan to have seen the online clips of him banging the drum after his debut win or interviews with other players singing his praises but they absolutely love him by the looks of things. The interviews have been gushing in praise and he is clearly see him as a leader already.

Sorry, you misunderstand. I meant the sustained pressure throughout the match of which the Singleton incident was a clear and visual marker. A show of the intent Wigan had brought to the match, if you will.

I think the unforced dropped ball was the 2nd incident (although that's not really relevant to the point I'm making).

His interview after the match was so telling, he's just made up to have a chance to play and earn a living through RL after what's happened with Toronto.

Singleton was a player I always looked out for. Years ago Stuart Fielding was coming back from an injury and played in the reserves/academy when you were allowed three overage players. Singleton played in that game as a young about seventeen year old and he went after Fielden from the start, very similar to the way he has done with the "bigger names" in the last three games.

how long did each player do on the pitch?