Using the "other people have been idiots on our board" as an excuse isn't something that shows people in a good light.

First of all you used the word idiot not me.

second it was you bragging about site traffic. Leeds traffic over the years blows wigans out of the water. One and a half seasons of doing well in SL has brought you into the light but don't get carried away mate.

Third the only place I know you from is trolling on the Leeds board. Obviously being a local yourself it's good banter which I've said to you before it's what its all about on these boards.

fourth after the McGuire thread on review I've no need to worry about been seen in a good light.

But to get this thread back on topic which is the part of my post you ignored. I thought with you been a mod you migh have engaged in RL talk?

Blaming individuals for a team loss is daft. Tomkin and sini are 2 of a few players who are SL's best by a mile.

I do engage in RL talk, perhaps if you'd looked you wouldn't have posted the rubbish above.

Just because you've been pulled up for childishly trying to derail a thread don't continue it by trying to make excuses for your childish behaviour. If you've got a problem with the moderation process PM the admin rather than making excuses on this thread.

Consider this your last warning. Thank you.

The reason we are so crap against the Aussies is they are used to playing high intensity games every week whereas half the teams in super league are e and its a stroll for the bigger clubs. This means our England players arent put under constant pressure every game and a lot of times get away with making poor decisions due to the poor quality of the opposition.

Until super league becomes more competitive on a high quality level, not just restricting the big clubs spending to drag them down to the crap teams level we will never get near Australia on a consistent basis.

I would start by cutting down super league to ensure more high quality games more often rather 40-50 nil drubbings.

get your head out of your mate.Its a team effort and u cant single out one player because he spilled 3 kicks!

We were too reliant on Sinfield's kicking game and it wasn't up to scratch. It was so predictable when he was going to kick on the 4th tackle and his poor kicks just gifted them field position. Then when we did throw the ball around, some individuals would spend too much time on the ball (mainly Chase).

I think a different coach would bring more structure to the team, but I think the players just weren't up to it. Soon as Lomax is fit he will be in the England team ahead of Sinfield and I'd have either Sam or Widdop in the halves with Lomax with the other at FB. Chase should of came on from the bench, or should not be included at all.

Saying that though, it's the first tournament most of these players have played together and we played some very good rugby at times. This team will only get better, its just unfortunate that Australia are too good.

Lomax isnt fit to lace sinfields boots let alone take his shirt.

You're a week late with that analogy.

Sinfield's a great player, but is far too inconsistent for England.

Going on Sinfield's 4 Nations performances I would say he is, even Briers had more of an impact in a poor Wales team than he did.

The game was lost in the basics of the game. Forwards need to lay a platform for backs to play. Englands forwards never made the yards or dominated the tackle. The backs simply got no decent ball.

If you swapped all the english backs with their aussie counterparts England would have still struggled to win with little field position and go-forward.

I also think that we do suffer from being in awe of the aussies. I even thought we would get beat the moment they scored in the opening minutes. Is this feeling of inevitability 'in-built' into me and every other english rl supporter/player from years of failure?

I would think if hall doesn't get it sinfield will get man of the series. I've watched the game a few times now and the funny thing is the Aussie media think England were good (few lucky calls aside). all the poms can do as fans is be divided. Wigan fans blaming sinfield! Most other clubs blaming tomkin, roby Morley and of course sinfield. Yes wakey fans we know it was chases fault!

It's pathetic

If Sinfield got man of the series now that would be pathetic. The whole point of his inclusion was for his kicking game and it wasn't up to it. I reckon Sam would have done a better job in the halves. It's got nothing to do with me being a Wigan fan, Sinfield just wasn't up to it, same as Sam but the difference being Sam received very little support from his teammates.

Don't be so dismissive.

You don't need to be a Saints fan to work out Sam wasn't very good. Cas fans can see that Chase was dreadful. Not only Rovers fans spotted that Briscoe was all over the place at times.

Far too many of England's supposedly 'big' players didn't perform, and Sinfield is in that bracket.

For our pack to be smashed in the way it did on Saturday is a big worry as we are supposed to have the better pack and they have the better backs.

In esscence they have the better squad and a better will to win IMO, to blame one individual is nothing far short of idiocy by those who do so !

Tim Sheens said we need to build on this tournament as we beat NZ and pushed the aussies in both games yet we now go back into the international shell for best part of 18 months unless the proposed tour to NZ Comes off, which is the worry

Have you thought that Tomkin, sinfield, chase performed just as they are, good players in a pretty average comp. What is needed for those players to improve is to get a tougher test week in week out. No doubt they can play the game. But with the level of ability they have a tougher test would see improvement in their individual games.