Just wondering what people think of him overall.

Iv always rated him, good head for rugby and great work rates especially in defence.

Yet the thread on the VT he is mentioned as one of the most overrated players.

I would say he is underrated myself, not very showy just puts the hard work in and is everywhere at once.

So what are peoples problems with him?

Top drawer. One of our best players.

I think he struggled a bit with fitness after returning from injury, but that's typical of him, puts his hand up to play when not 100%, massive commitment to the club, tough nut, and hard hitting defender.
Like him a lot.

People from other club's generally only pay attention to the flashy players from rival club's. Even our own casual fans someties miss what players like McIllorum bring to the side. He's a vital part of our engine, does the dirty work that often goes unnoticed, just like Lockers.

They would not be saying he was overrated when (if selected) they watch him batter and bruise the Ockers in the World cup.

You only get to appreciate a player like MMc when you see him week in and week out.

There are some very good hookers around at the moment in Roby, Lunt, Clark and Houghton. These players are very good at making quick metres and score plenty of tries which MMc doesn't really. But what he does is intimidate the opposition and these players rarely get the better of him. Opposition fans just don't see this and a bit like with Sean O'Loughlin think he's overrated.

I wouldn't swap him. As he proved against Huddersfield - his tackling is second to none.

By the way - hats off to Sean Wane as he has nursed MMc through this season by giving Logan plenty of game time. So that MMc is nice and fresh come the play-offs. He will do 80 minutes from here on in. We haven't had any brainstorms like against Saints last season which ruled him out of the playoffs which really hurt us against Leeds.

(Having said all that anyone who thinks Cameron Smith would be scared of him is seriously deluded - I presume that was a joke?)

I would say he is a bit like Terry Newton, for example in the test match were Moz was sent off after 10 seconds, it was Terry who really took it to the Roos and really was wnding them up. In a similar situation I could quite easilly see MM doing this.

The comparison with Lockers is interesting. It took some of our own fans years to recognise his quality.

I suspect that sadly MM will have to wait a very long time for wider recognition because of his playing style but any Wigan fan that doesn't rate him needs their head examining - he is not on a par with Lockers but he is a hugely important part of our side. We will need him firing on all cylinders to get to and then win the GF.

I don't think fans failed to recognise Lockers talents as a player. The debate was always about his captaincy. If you want a comparison with another Wigan player seriously underrated by our own fans, certainly in the past if not now, it is Hansen IMO.

I said in response to some tool on the VT calling him a talentless thug that you could ask any Wigan fan, staff member or player how good he is and they'll shower praise on him. I described him as the heartbeat of this team (along with Lockers). They set a frantic tempo when we're at our best that the other forwards follow and we then lay a platform for our backs to work with.

One other thing I said was I bet if you asked opposition players their thoughts on him I'm sure they would explain what a torrid time he can give you.

He's a fantastic player IMO and he just keeps getting better.

I think it was both, and I (who was definitely in this camp) believe that I was justified in my criticism. Just as now I believe he has matured into a very good player.

You can tell how good he is by the way we perform when he's not on the pitch.
As for talentless thug! That RL for jealous

Lockers was attacked as a player and captain on this board. I remember people agreeing with Saints and Wire fans who said he wasn't international class (just before he played very well indeed against NZ) and some who said he wasn't even SL standard, which was laughable. You know who you are (BK this is not aimed at you, though I disagreed with you then and still do, mind you it did confuse the Wigan-hating idiots who thought that we were the same person because we held the same views on the SC!).

Then when his status as a top player was unarguable people clung on to arguing that he was a rubbish captain. Mainly because he didn't shout at people the way Faz did. And there's the problem, Faz was an amazing player and held together a crumbling side through his strength of will and his physical presence and skills in a way that no other British player I've seen could have done. When Lockers took over as captain there were few leaders in the team and to expect a young captain to dominate the field in the way that Faz did was ridiculous and totally unfair to Lockers. That he took the job on and stuck at it is a testament to the guy. He was our best option then and he has matured into an outstanding player and captain, with a different style of leadership from Faz, but one which is still very effective. He will never be his brother in law. He will, though, be a Wigan legend.

Mcllorum is only behind O'Loughlin and Sam in terms of importance to our team IMO, although in recent weeks it could be argued Smith is now up there.

If he can improve his distribution he would be pushing to be the best 9 in SL..cut out the forward passes from the ruck..