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FORUMS > Wigan Warriors > Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE |
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| Quote: Stu M "It was my youngest lads football presentation yesterday so I was out all afternoon and haven't seen the game. I'm also one of those fans that won't watch it back when we lose, sad I know.
I think more of the fans frustrations are with Wellens and how risk averse he is. It makes it worse when we see our nearest and dearest doing so well and a rookie coach who has never coached before (Head coach I mean) completely transforming the club. Farrimond being given a chance on Friday shows a willingness to try the young lads.
Wellens has not blooded any young lads really, Stephens has only been given a chance due to too many injuries in the forwards, same with Delaney last season.
We have a young lad absolutely killing it in the Academy and Reserves- Robertson scoring 3 basically every week and clearly far too good for that level. Lomax has been out and yet he hasn't even had 20 mins. London away would've been the ideal game. Royle and Davies aren't Saints standard and get about 20 mins game time between them, absolute waste of two subs.
Yesterday didn't surprise me too much. We have been a wet weather team now for a while and in dry conditions against a team that promote the ball so well, we struggle as was proved.
I said a couple of weeks I would be absolutely staggered if Wigan didn't finish top and given we have to play them twice, Warrington twice, Leigh away twice plus HKR and Salford still then we are in a real danger of not finishing in the top two.
Wellens is clearly staying next year yet the club haven't made an annoucement. Not sure when they will pick a time as July is a very tricky month. Cas at home next game should be routine but Wigan away will be very hard obviously, plus Warrington who can be hit and miss but are a team that know how to beat us and have the game plan to do so.
In relation to Welsby I think people are going off the fact that he is now a big earner so more is expected. He has looked back to his best lately but I suppose you have to temper that with the quality of opposition. I think we are lost without him but unfortunately when he doesn't fire then he gets the blame from a small minority. I wonder whether he is starting to regret not going to the NRL.
It's going to be a couple of seaons transition for us I feel as the old guard start to break up and we introduce the new lads. I know we are talking to a few players but a lot depends on whether Matautia stays or goes as to what direction we go in. He has been my Player of the season by a distance but I'd be amazed if he does another year. A NRL club will come in for him for sure.'"
Welsby might yet end up in the NRL, I believe he has a release clause in his Saints deal. From my viewing yesterday what came as a surprise is that Salford dominated field position for long periods and Saints completion was very poor. Your forwards struggled to make yards which may be a consequence of their size.The commentary team kept advising the viewer that Saints have scored more tries, and conceded less than any other team this season, so all cannot be bad. However, apart from Welsby there does seem a lack of pace in the back line so taking your point Stu, I think there is a need to blood some young lads. Personally, I still think Saints will be a handful come play off time if they can get all their troops fit and firing.
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| Last night was one of the worst perfomances i've seen in 53 years of watching Saints no idea in attack awful kicking as per
Then in his presser Wellens threw the players under the bus
Plus Dodd having a go at the fans at the end of the game
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[b:3rwwi1cz][color=#800000:3rwwi1cz]WIGAN RLFC - SL ERA
WORLD CLUB CHAMPIONS 2017 & 2024
SUPER LEAGUE CHAMPIONS 1998, 2010, 2013, 2016, 2018 & 2023
CHALLENGE CUP FINAL WINNERS 2002, 2011, 2013, 2022 & 2024
LEAGUE LEADERS CHAMPIONS 2010, 2012, 2020 & 2023
ACADEMY GRAND FINAL WINNERS 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2013, 2014, 2015, 2017, 2018 & 2019
WOMEN’S GRAND FINAL WINNERS 2018
BEST SUPPORTED CLUB OF THE YEAR 2010, 2011 & 2012
CLUB OF THE YEAR 2010 & 2012
[/color:3rwwi1cz][/b:3rwwi1cz]: |
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| I can see Saints having a decent dig to start with on Friday as a reaction from yesterday so we need to be up for them early on.
This has got me thinking, will they put in a better performance than Leigh did against us last night, I thought they played really well overall but in the end our class came through.
We owe Saints big time for Good Friday where I thought we let ourselves down but we're unlucky to have a few decisions go against us. I think winning this Friday could really give us momentum going through the rest of the season, no doubt Peet has given the players targets to meet.
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13145_1273270974.jpg :d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_13145.jpg |
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| I'm not convinced Saints have done all that much wrong. The fans are getting angry just as Wigan fans would after a performance like that. But I think a decline was somewhat inevitable after four straight titles which was unquestionably an incredible achievement.
Off the back of success in a salary cap sport comes the need to hand out larger contracts to the players that got them there so it leaves you with little room to change things when the tide turns. You cant replace James Roby - one of the best ever SL players (maybe the best). Losing Regan Grace was a blow but he picked up long term injuries anyway. They couldn't have accounted for Lewis Dodd's regression. I think when the streak was broken it may have been difficult to reset the motivation levels given what had been achieved. Giving a young English coach a crack should be applauded - it worked for Wigan with Wane and Peet but not for Saints with Cunningham and Wellens. Given the success of Holbrook and Woolf I guess it's understandable that Saints fans want to look overseas again.
The squad will need to evolve significantly over the next couple of years but I still wouldn't rule them out of stringing three playoff games together at the end of the year with a fit squad who would have a point to prove.
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| Wellens is the fall guy. He should be applauded for even taking the job. Nobody could rebuild a side in a couple of years. It's the exact same scenario as Man Utd gave Moyes. Ferguson got every last ounce out of them the previous season as did Woolf. Nobody could have steadied that ship and the majority of the blame has to go with the recruitment team.
All that being said however, long may it continue
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65656_1708941604.jpg [size=95:2obtgspq]23 LEAGUE TITLES[/size:2obtgspq]
[size=95:2obtgspq]21 CHALLENGE CUPS[/size:2obtgspq]
[size=95:2obtgspq]5 WORLD TITLES[/size:2obtgspq]
[b:2obtgspq][color=#FF0000:2obtgspq][size=100:2obtgspq]SAYS IT ALL REALLY[/size:2obtgspq][/color:2obtgspq][/b:2obtgspq]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_65656.jpg |
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| Three takeaway bits on this/Saints/us from me...
1. Success is cyclical. Their great side (& it was a great side) is undoubtedly at the back end of a cycle. We seem to be at the start of something. That's sport, I'll enjoy it whilst we're on top but I won't gloat too much either - we'll be back there one day (just hopefully not too soon tho)
2. Their decline shows how important having a long term head coach is. I hope that, when our cycle comes to its natural end, Matty Peet is still here. Transitioning well and not having a complete drop-off, is a lot easier when you keep the same coach/manager. Bellamy, Fergie etc are the blueprints for this.
3. I still think that, should Saints get a couple of players back, there's one last big punch in them. The only question is - can Wellens motivate them enough?
4. We need to beat them on Friday. No excuses and for me, it's another acid test for finding out how good of side we are. When the roles were reversed, Saints always made us pay. Let's do the same.
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Wigan |
15 |
427 |
170 |
257 |
26 |
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
St.Helens |
16 |
429 |
170 |
259 |
22 |
Warrington |
16 |
406 |
213 |
193 |
22 |
Hull KR |
15 |
383 |
201 |
182 |
22 |
Salford |
15 |
295 |
288 |
7 |
20 |
Catalans |
15 |
288 |
220 |
68 |
18 |
|
Leeds |
16 |
291 |
286 |
5 |
18 |
Huddersfield |
16 |
298 |
365 |
-67 |
12 |
Leigh |
15 |
270 |
250 |
20 |
11 |
Castleford |
16 |
246 |
435 |
-189 |
9 |
Hull FC |
15 |
198 |
474 |
-276 |
4 |
LondonB |
16 |
156 |
615 |
-459 |
2 |
Betfred Championship 2024 ROUND : 1 | | PLD | F | A | DIFF | PTS |
Wakefield |
13 |
486 |
142 |
344 |
26 |
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Sheffield |
14 |
382 |
217 |
165 |
22 |
Bradford |
13 |
341 |
218 |
123 |
18 |
Toulouse |
12 |
332 |
174 |
158 |
16 |
Widnes |
13 |
315 |
245 |
70 |
15 |
Featherstone |
13 |
330 |
283 |
47 |
12 |
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Batley |
13 |
205 |
286 |
-81 |
12 |
Doncaster |
13 |
237 |
325 |
-88 |
11 |
York |
14 |
285 |
293 |
-8 |
10 |
Whitehaven |
13 |
266 |
358 |
-92 |
10 |
Halifax |
14 |
270 |
405 |
-135 |
10 |
Barrow |
12 |
203 |
339 |
-136 |
10 |
Swinton |
13 |
260 |
332 |
-72 |
8 |
Dewsbury |
14 |
168 |
419 |
-251 |
2 |
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