Correct Nicky. You pretty much describe Adrian Morley there too. (one of the most feared forwards ever to play the game) I remember him coming through at Leeds. A lanky second rower with not much in the way of go forward but was as tough as old boots at a very young age. The rest of his game developed with experience.

Your argument is based on how many trophies a player wins as to a marker of good they are as a player. Its nonsense and far too simplistic thinking to get the true picture. It simply means that Morley was in the right place at the right time just as Ricky Bibby was when he won 2 challenge cup medals. Morley was over rated, i had Aussie friends who i used to talk to around the time he played in Aus and they all voiced frustration about him flying out of the line trying to put on a big hit and missing more than he connected.

Whereas you fail to address any point I make. You're now supporting your opinions with your 'Aussie friends'. You are also missing the point. Morley wasn't an Ian Kirke, he was selected for multiple high profile clubs who had their pick of players. If Morley was 'just a thug'...
-Why would Sydney Roosters not recruit an NRL player? why fly out a player from the other side of the world to play in a top side?
-Why would several GB and England coaches select Morley time and time again as a starting prop when they had literally every GB/English forward to pick from?

Take a look at the Bradford side that did what they could to loan him.

Whereas your argument of Ricky Bibey is terrible. He wasn't signed multiple times by top teams and certainly wasn't chosen to represent his country, he was a journey man.

I'm now concerned you're not getting this.

I never said 'he was just a thug'. I think you are barking up the wrong tree. Ive said time and time again that he was a good player but it was the aggression that made him a good player and the rest of his game was just decent/average. I find him over rated, that means i dont think he was as good as he is made out to be. You seem to be doing mental gymnastics in order to try and make out that i have said he was crap/garbage or rubbish. You are immortalising Morley like the holy grail of props when he simply wasnt.

Nope.

This is what I'm saying; 'Morley has been one of the best British props in the last few decades'. I don't think saying that makes him overrated. I have supported that with listing his achievements (which puts him above nearly all GB forwards) And then explained how he's achievements also reflect his career and performances. All that evidences and supports my statement.

In opposition you've offered nothing in the slightest to counter my statement. You've backed yourself up with your own opinion and 'your Aussie mates'.

It's that clear really. Not exactly 'mental gymnastics' it's a simple process of making a statement and supporting it with facts.

Some posters in here are fantastic at countering a point, offering a different take to back up a different opinion with facts and not just opinion. Hopefully you'll get there one day mate

I thought this site was about Lockers replacement and not about 5 pages of Morley.