I'm not sure what relevance that has to the issue of Hohaia's retirement. Unless you're saying it was self-defence.

If Lance had done what he set out when he snapped, Flower would have had a broken Jaw/Cheek. He would have been off the field, you'd have lost and he would have been the bad guy.

As fortune had it for himself and Saints, he wasn't successful in doing that when he elbowed Flower and it's only what happened after that took the spotlight away from his deliberate attempt to hurt someone, he should have seen red also. Laugh all you like, but he was no angel and Flower could have come out of it much worse off than Hohaia did, like I say, it was just good fortune he didn't and ended up the victim of his own cheap shot. The alternate scenario could so easily have been that his team lost the Grand final and he gets a long ban.

Typical reaction by a Saints fan in denial.

Can not accept that LH was in the wrong as well.

As well as having to get rid of him to bring in another player. At Wigan its called youth development at Saints its Overseas Development.

They were both in the wrong technically, but Lance didn't drop his fist on someone who was already out cold on the floor, did he?

You make an interesting point, it would appear that Lance was OK post-Flowergate. During this time he trained which includes some pretty hard training and it's only after he has retuned to playing which would seem to infer that there is a trigger in one of the games since playing, presumably a bang to the head? As it wasn't there before his return to playing, post the Grand Final by Lance's statement.

As many have posted, it's the single bang to the head that matters and not the cumulative effect in this particular case. With the lack of issue prior to playing again this would really suggest that the injury is one which has recently happened in a game in this season.

ha ha, is this still going on?

the topic is lances retirement, not who punched who.

the whole issue has been mishandled in my opinion, I think the investigations should have happened with lance remaining a saints player, whether actually playing or not, until more is know about what the next steps are. for all we know, lance is probably more than happy to accept his part in the GF incident and doesn't want to take it further, yet the issue with his retirement is simply coincidence. he has after all "forgiven" ben and has been very sporting in doing so, to which both players are trying to move on. poor lance probably doesn't want this topic bringing up again, heck its probably hanging over his head more than bens.

ultimately, the media coverage is fuelling a non-existent fire in my opinion. the RFL need to put a stop to it and bring a statement out asap. then saints can go back to bumming their new star FB and we can get on with our own things.

... crikey, the st Helens reporter seems to think they have all the answers already... www.sthelensreporter.co.uk/sport ... -1-7236515

... crikey, the st Helens reporter seems to think they have all the answers already... www.sthelensreporter.co.uk/sport ... -1-7236515

Quote WiganBurt="WiganBurt"... crikey, the st Helens reporter seems to think they have all the answers already... www.sthelensreporter.co.uk/sport ... -1-7236515'" And now it's a liable case unless the paper has proof...

Quote WiganBurt="WiganBurt"... crikey, the st Helens reporter seems to think they have all the answers already... www.sthelensreporter.co.uk/sport ... -1-7236515'" And now it's a liable case unless the paper has proof...

Libel*

Do you really want me to list how many Academy graduates currently playing for Saints?

P.S. who did you replace Sam Tomkins with?

Ssssshhhhhhhhhh.