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Quote: DaveO "You totally missed the point there. Les Cat's had to play the top ranked team as a reward for finishing 4th. 8th got to play 5th and 5th got 8th which are obviously both easier games on paper. The fact Les Cat's didn't turn up doesn't alter that.'"

And you seem to be intent on ignoring the fact they got two bites at the cherry. Yes playing Wigan would be harder than playing Wakefield, but the advantage of winning that game is greater and the negative of losing it is lesser. Les Catalans win the progress to the elimination semi-final, Leeds win they progress to the preliminary semi-final. Les Catalans lose they go through to the preliminary semi-final, Leeds lose they are out.

Quote: DaveO "So what? It doesn't alter the fact in round one they had to play 1st. '"

A game they lost. Les Catalans lost and still got the home advantage, leeds won and didn’t. Why you are insisting on pretending that getting an opportunity to progress directly to the elimination semi-final is worse than not getting that opportunity, getting two bites of the cherry is worse than getting only one, and home advantage having lost game is worse than not getting home advantage even after winning a game I don’t know.

Quote: DaveO "It's actually a statistical fact that different playoff systems reward league positions differently to each other and that is what the debate is about, not the form of one team in any one year.

In the McIntrye final five system the statistical chance of 1st winning the whole thing is 37.5%. In the top 8 system he devised it drops to 18.75%.

The obvious and inescapable conclusion is the top 5 system rewards league position more and we have adopted a system that doesn't (its statistically even worse than the McIntrye top 8 ).

God knows why you are so wedded to the top 8 system. It's garbage in terms of rewarding league position.'"

No it isnt.