O/T but it got me thinking about refs, and could not help remembering a football ref from the 70's called Roger Kirkpatrick, a great character who talked to players and had respect. My feeling are that our present crop of RL refs are just a little too bland, and don't get the respect of the players. I don't think any are particularly bad, i just don't think they are particularly good. Not stopping the backchat, and handling friction are two areas where they are sadly lacking. Not tough enough on the backchat, and ridiculasly over the top with trouble when it erupts. Aliberts errors can be pointed out, but the same can be done with all the others.

Erm, Lima's try from a forward pass at Wembley, Stevie Wonder saw that one !!!!, there is no bias or favouritism against Wigan by referees, no 'agendas' either, we get bad calls, and we get good calls from refs,and video refs,(Tommy's 'benefit of the doubt' try in the final could have gone either way)we just have to get on with it, as John Monie says in his book, "the 2 things you cant control are the referee and the weather", we didn't play to our potential on Saturday, Leeds did, congratulate them and concentrate on London and beyond, Keep the Faith !!!

Regardless of which ref is appointed each week, there's always a few who'll expect him to lose us the game or something daft - it rarely transpires that way. Alibert, this season's miscounting issues aside, usually seems to get on just fine - the only issue I'd have with him is that it's not always clear what he's doing or giving, which in turn makes it look as though he's a bit clueless, but in general I can't think of many games that have been 'ruined' by him, and there's no sense of him trying to steal the show like Ganson on occasion.

Thaler's error in awarding that try to Leeds without going upstairs was a big one, at a crucial point in the game. It's stupid that when everyone else in the stadium knows it was a knock-on, and we have the video technology there to show it within seconds, that he's made a decision and stuck to it; that's what the video ref should eradicate, for me. Ultimately though, Wigan were second best on Saturday, Leeds deserved the win, and Thaler probably hurt his own chances of being involved at Wembley more than he did ours. He's been the best of the bunch in Super League this year and I would have thought he'd have been in line for the job at the Final next month, but after getting such a crucial call wrong, he may have cost himself the chance, and I'm sure if that's the case he'd be gutted and do it differently next time.

As for Wigan not benefitting from howlers - Jeff Lima's second try at Wembley last season?

The biggest howler I can remember Wigan being awarded was against Wakefield a few years ago, when Danny Orr clearly dropped the ball over the line, but it was given by the video ref. IIRC, it was later "evened out" by the Solomona disgrace.

I do feel like other teams are more likely to get the 50/50 or 60/40 calls than we are though, makes it a pleasant surprise when one does go our way.