Thought his technique was quite decent earlier in the season. Didn't he damage his foot after kicking so many against crusaders? Perhaps it's an still an issue? I should imagine he's working hard at it. Valuable points slipping away though.

Behave. It is a derby at a neutral stadium. We could lose top spot at the magic weekend. Wire will beat wakey and widnes without any problems.

Technique for Charnley differs for each kick, reminds of watching us prior to Botica with many inconsistent kickers. Ben a long time since I've thought we were going to miss a kick but that is how it is now. We need to get Dave Aldred or even Farrell in to teach someone how to to kick. It can be learned. Mental is so much, Pat has it, I think Sam could do it with the correct coaching, it's vital to us though, one day we will may be bitten by it.

Training is one thing, but a few matches have now shown that Josh simply isn't a top quality place kicker.

Right touchline is always difficult for a right footer.

More tries from the left needed maybe ?

After the likes of Jim Sullivan, Frano Botica, and lately Pat Richards, whoever takes over the 'kicking boots' has a lot to play up to at Wigan.

Botica did indeed learn how to kick at Wigan, and became one of the best kickers ever. Certainly the best I have ever seen.

Felt for the lad really. He had 3 tough chances and lost confidence by the time he got to an easier 4th attempt.

I think it's time for Sam to step in now. He's not as technically good as Charnley but he's ice cool and that will do him wonders.

Must admit the thought crossed my mind that conversions could be a key point tonight....Brough did nail a beauty tbf.

I made the point on the MOM thread that the kicks were tough (imo) apart from the attempt for Carmont's first try. Conditions wise, it was a poor night with the wind and rain.

In the first half I was scared to death that we were going to lose that match because of the missed kicks. It could cost us dearly this season and could ultimately be the difference between winning silverware and not.

With regards to Josh it is not just that he misses it is the fact that he never looks confident kicking and he doesnt seem to have a set technique. All the top kickers kick in exactly the same way time and again, week in week out. Josh hits the ball completely different each time and didnt strike any of last nights kicks cleanly. If he kicked with a set technique, hit them clean and they had just went wide then fair enough but he didnt and its the way he missed, rather than the misses themselves, that trouble me from a kicking point of view going forward.

This is our biggest problem at the moment with Pat being out, which says a lot about how good our form is at present. It does need addressing though, as i a tight game which we will have sooner or later it could cost us. It's amazing how you just take it for granted when Pat is kicking.

I would get Josh and Sam to practice like mad, but my gut feel says that I reckon Sam would be more of a better bet.

Frano Botica was an excellent goal kicker when he came to wigan, in fact I think he was signed originally because of this. He definitely got even better whilst at Wigan and became almost 100% reliable. We surely do not have to get any one else in to give kicking instruction when we have one of the best on staff in Paul Deacon

Conditions were bad last night. I'm not too worried.

The weird thing is, I would back Josh to kick one from the Touchline but I would never back Sam to do that, but i think Sam is the more consistent and safer kicker if that makes sense?

Maybe we should just alternate and have Josh kick the hard ones and Sam kick the easier ones which Josh seems to consistently miss