honestly these london/expansion haters are living in some kind of dreamland. Thinking things will be much better with just the M62 clubs is pure madness!!

RL is a northern sport, yes its played worldwide but in England its a northern sport, Catalan do well crowd wise (at home) because traditionally the catalunia area its played in is a French RL heartland, wales isnt neither is London, jesus Sheffield 35 miles away from cas cant get decent crowds, they won the challenge cup not long back and they have gone backwards, you cannot force RL or any other sport onto areas/communities. it has to grow, London has had a fair crack of the whip and if they cannot survive on their own now, its time for a rethink.

I remember one of your young guys - Lamont Bryan I think it was - featuring on Boots'n'All earlier in the season. When interviewed, he said he [igrew up[/i watching Quins RL (in its various guises) and had [ialways wanted[/i to play for them.

Many RL supporters in my general neck of the woods do not appreciate what a turning point that is for rugby league in London. In the north we take it for granted that young people are routinely exposed to rugby league and the aspiration to play for your local club is the norm in many areas. To have achieved that in London should shout loudly to RL supporters everywhere that far from failing as a club, Quins RL are actually succeeding in a way that many northern clubs are not. And it is the reason why the RFL should, I believe, step in and provide [iwhatever[/i assistance to Quins RL that they need to take them forward.

The first generation of RL supporters are coming through. A generation is measured in 25 year spells, I believe. If Quins RL is allowed to fail now then that would be a serious case of negligence and stupidity by the RFL because such good work should not be allowed to unravel.

If your chairman needs financial help either to attract additional investors or to tide the club over until such time as they can become more competitive on the field, then the RFL should supply it. Not because Quins are failing but because they are doing quite the opposite.

And, as I've said elsewhere, they should enable the club to invest in a damn good coach who will take the players to the next level and buy a couple of seriously huge Samoans for the front row as Quins are sadly lacking in that department.

And you are embarrassing.

with the progression in Junior development and Rugby League played in London/South East Schools are people ready to just close the door on this?

Quins have played a huge part in junior Rugby League down here so no matter what happens I hope the RFL keep investing in youth development down south.

for what its worth here's another hull kr fans view, I have always loved my away trips to london to see my team and have always made a weekend of it with the mrs as a lot of people do but over the last few years as an outsider you can't get away from the fact that your club appears to be in a spiral of decline.

Obviously money is tight, the playing squad seems to get weaker every year and the crowds seem to have hit rock bottom. It seems to me the move to twickenham is doing you no favours. The ground is excellent for a superleague team, the facilities are excellent but nobody seems to want to go there, if you could pick the ground up and plonk it in central london you'd be on a winner. Having seen you in griffin park and at fulham all those years ago as well as chiswick, you need to be in a more central location where more casual supporters might give league a try, being stuck out on a limb in the middle of a Union stronghold just isn't working. It seems like you're stuck between a rock and a hard place as any ground share in central london is going to be ridiculously expensive and there aren't that many options (loftus road wouldn't be a bad option but obviously is never going to happen).

It seems to me you've got 2 real options for the future, a rich warringtonesque sugar daddy takes over or you move to a better location, the olympic stadium wouldn't be bad if west ham get knocked back and it is scaled down as per the original plans. Moving to milton keynes or dropping into the championship will be the death knell for your club.

I do wish you well though, not because of some "rugby league needs a london presence" rubbish, but because of the die hard fans who go week in week out.

Of course you can't force any sport onto any community unless you're totalitarian, and nobody has been trying to do that.

So, what's your rethink?

Quins fans would no better than me but I have always thought the location was killer. RU heartland and outside of London!

Could a move to back to SE London be an option again, Charlton or Millwall?

Charlton was not that great but we started a lot of kids playing from there. West London seems to have been best but unless we get results on the pitch it's immaterial where we play - the fans won't support a losing team.

As much as most want the Quins club to succeed, this is just simply unfair. As a sport, all clubs have to start on a level playing-field. Most SL clubs could do with extra finances but these cannot be given to some clubs and not to others. Cas/Wakefield/Salford could do with the RFL offering financial help to build new stadia, how is this different to financially backing Quins. Ridiculous.

There is only 5% of the population of The Metropolitan Borough of St Helens interested in Saints and that is a Fact! and you think a new ground is going to turn the world around? look at the population of say Castleford and their crowds in a rubbish stadium much better than Saints and with no success.

Sky will reduce their funding if it goes to an M62 sport there is no doubts and then it will become a 10 team league and that may end up with Sky pulling out!

But judging by your comment it is ok to give Quins or any other expansion club less funds than others in the full knowledge that the buying power of what they have been provided with will actually buy less than the same amount of money given to others located in the heartlands. Similarly it is ok for an expansion club to have to use a disproportionate part of their funding in order to promote the game, market the club and develop players in a new expansion area.....whereas the heartland club has a much easier ride because the local community is already sold on the game?

Because of its size and the amount of competion for punters liesure pounds, London is an incredibly hard place to get new people interested.......Quins marketing attempts are not the best and their scatter gun approach has reaped little reward........but you could argue that their job is to produce a rugby team not directly sell the sport of RL.

If the RFL are serious about expanding the sport they have to invest in building, promoting and selling the game, you cannot seriously expect the expansion club to do all that from the same funding allocation as everyone else (plus whatever extra DH has contributed), as well as producing a competitive team on the pitch. It all amounts to spreading the available funds too thinly, DH has done it for years and he is now saying enough is enough, I am funding a club, I am not here to do the RFL`s work in promoting and developing the sport.

Some good points. The only one I disagree with is your point about 'RL needs a london presence' being rubbish. As someone who loves rl & who lives in London, I can see how much having an SL team does make a difference to the awareness of the game here. Its great to see people getting more involved as a result - & especially how many youngsters are playing the game with local amateur teams. & because I love the game so much I dont want it to be confined to the M62 corridor in this country. In this day & age of sport needing money to thrive, sponsorship is essential - & a company like Sporting Bet is more likely to sponsor HKR because they anticipate getting exposure for their brand beyond the confines of a relatively small part of the country. Expansion - especially in the lucrative market of London - is very important for the long term health of the game everywhere.

I agree with you on the problems with the ground. Having tried taking friends to the Stoop, after going once they tend not to go again - largely because it takes such a long time to get there & they dont want to spend the best part of a weekend day doing that. I live in London but it takes me longer to get to Quins games than it would take me to travel from East Hull to Leeds, Bradford or even, sometimes, Warrington.

However, I think the problems go further than the location of the ground. I'm not in favour of Quins being given special dispensation by the RFL & despite the fact that it is more costly for people to live in London its not been a major barrier to players coming to the club, so dont see why Quins should be given more from the Sky purse like some on here have argued. If that happened, we could then start arguing that clubs with a greater portion of their catchment area on the dole should have their season tickets subsidised by the RFL because their supporters cant afford them, or clubs who's councils give less to them than others should get more from the RFL etc etc (tho that certainly shouldnt stop the HKR supporters lobbying their council for some investment in the stadium - I admire what they've been doing). There will never be an even playing field & nothing can stop that.

What would make sense would be for the RFL to support a marketing campaign that promotes the game (& with it Quins RL) in the capital, plus help ensure that whatever other issues are going on that those deeply involved in the club keep alluding to are resolved.

The major sponsor of Rugby League SKY wanted the game to expand and have a presence out of the M62 Corridor, do you fully realise how much money BSkyB have invested into the game and I still think the majority of it wasted! grounds were left to crumble and become so dated, but meanwhile average players could command £50,000 salary easily, so I feel your presumption that the game does not need a team in the capital as much rubbish!

It would have been so easily for me to have supported and followed St Helens, born there and lived here all my life, supported West Ham from the age of 6 and attended the first game at Fulham and been loyal ever since, but I Believed in the development of our great game, it is a credit to the South how strong the amateur/school game is now much more popular than many Northern heartland town's.

I supported the name change, but it has not worked, I am unsure about the area and travelling time, but nothing compared to an home game for myself. I still think the game can work in London, but it needs marketing something even top clubs like St Helens can't even get right and the correct area which will build a fan base, the game has to be sold at a competitive ticket price which makes it affordable for families and so much cheaper than football. I still remember sitting in the stand for that debut game Fulham V Wigan with families including grandparents and they enjoyed and loved the game so much.

The game in the North is far too parochial people are only interested in their own clubs, these fans the ones who write the letters to the weekly rugby press need to accept and realise lose London and Crusaders, even Catalan which many would love and Sky will either reduce there money to a minimum or withdraw their support full stop, then who will pay the players wages and the costs for these new stadiums, the game could go like Wrestling did!

"I must point out ... that the British nation is unique in this respect. They are the only people who like to be told how bad things are, who like to be told the worst, and like to be told that they are very likely to get much worse in the future and must prepare themselves for further reverses."

I'm quoting Churchill here; this is how bad we have taken a few comments, when the real line from Hughes is that he wants another Lenagan to come in and relieve the burden. Does anyone here seriously believe that there will not be a Super League club in London next year?