Just seen the low lights on sky.
Embarassing!!!!

I didn't guess the cost of tickets, I simply used the plan of the stadium and then worked out how many members there were.

What I did do, was model a scenario where 70% of the PAYING attendees did so as adults at the lowest published price. I also factored in 36% of the attendees getting in for nothing.....but you roll out the kids and pensioners as some sort of magic number?

Basically put, if I take 100 of the 70% and crunch them as 50% discounted attendees, to go with the 36% on a freebie, then AK has still seen/will see in excess of £200,000 this year at the gate......not counting any residual income from beer and food sales or the shop, parking or any of the other tickets he clips. This also pays no heed to his marketing stipend that the RFL gave him, which he seems to have spent on travel cards for Buck and Dusty.

Hell.....I can actually take 200 and treat them as kids and pensioners, as well as 15% Hive member discounts and he's still up over £200,000........and he's still not happy.

Therefore.....if we stay at the Hive it will be as tenants and we will be paying a rent similar or greater to that which we faced at the Stoop.

I didn't say you guessed the cost of tickets. I said I thought your ticket revenue of over £300k was way off, something you now seem to be appreciating.

TK will be concerning himself with next years forecast based on expected ticket sales/costs and not making a decision based on being happy or sad on the current year. The claim that this years ticket revenue determines how much Broncos will pay next year is false.

Your last line is without any foundation and none of the assumptions that precede it actually prove the conclusion.

You know there is one thing i am going to look forward to next year.

being able to have a thread on here talking about the forthcoming game without the obligitory post from NZ quoting a bunch of pointless percentages, previous crowds, and revenue from the previous games against that club. Their will be no stats as most clubs we will not have played against

At a tenner a ticket he's taking £160,000 this year.....at £25 a pop he's taking £400,000. I reckon he's somewhere in the middle and as I have said, I've been doing this a long time with the Broncos and I am normally right within 5%.


The claim is that this years ticket revenue will dictate that the club WILL PAY RENT if they want to stay and if you think that AK will accept a rent lower than his income on the gate this year, then you need to get a grip.



Just for you....if we continue to average 1,250, then 16,250 will attend all season. We paid £222,244 in rent for the Stoop in 2012. Simple maths point to £13.68 as an average ticket price for the attendees generating the GATE revenue to cover that much "rent".

Tickets at The Hive for the cheapest member (adult non pensioner) work out at £16.61. Cheapest on the day ticket (adult-non pension/no code) is £20.00. Factor in the following....
16% (200) attendees are ST/Members paying a minimum of £13.68 = £2,736
32% (400) attendees are in for nothing.... = £0.00
26% (325) attendees are paying £20.00 = £6,500
10% (125) attendees are Kids paying £5 = £625
10% (125) attendees are pensioner paying £12 = £1,500
6% (75) attendees are Hive members who have accepted the 15% discount and pay £17 = £1,275.

Now.....remember, the above is based on cheap prices. It delivers £12,636 of match-day gate receipts or £164,268. It is based on 400 freebies per game and only 325 paying full price, so is skewed to suit the agenda that AK isn't coining it in. It takes no account of spend INSIDE his venue in HIS bars and food concessions or in HIS shop either. Nobody has parked a car in HIS car Park either......

AK was adamant at the start of the year that Freebies would be limited.......I have included 32% of this years crowds as freebies. If This figure was 16% freebies and the rest paying the cheapest price (£20), then AK's revenue is up by £52,000. If I'm out by the same numbers on Kids and pensioners? Wow....another £32,500. Bugger me......there's £250,000 in ticket revenue based on 200 Members, 125 kids/pensioners, 200 freebies per game and the rest paying to sit in the cheapest corner seats........not 1 person has paid for a premium ticket.......as I say, if I am 5% out as I have been in the past......well what do you know, you have a similar figure to that we used to pay in rent to the Stoop.

Next year the club will get an average of 500 fans paying £15 each to 11 regular season games, then maybe 750 to 4 ties against SL clubs with prices at £20. There's £142,500 on the gate for 15 games.....if it costs AK more than £9,500 to open said gates, he'll charge us rent.....and he has the added bonus of Knowing that we have £900,000 of funding burning a hole in our back pockets. Downside for him is that if we do pay rent, WE set the pricing for his stadium.......you wendyball fans won't be too impressed with that

No Michael......we have played a good number of the clubs in the Championship over the years and there are stats to go with them.

Your attitude is, I have to say, indicative of why the club is in the mire.......the desire to discuss the football is fine, but your constant state of denial is alarming. 2015 will be fun Michael, but don't expect it to be any better than the last few years......same owner, same , different division.

Sorry gf I dont have the time or inclination to read your tome. Can you turn off the verbose setting?

The short version?
AK was BRIBED by the RFL for 2014 and he now wants his cake and to eat it. Based on 2014's attendances, The numbers for 2015 will not add up, but he knows we have a few quid in a parachute payment, so he'll try to squeeze a few bob extra out of us in 2015......and thanks to the mess created by Hughes and his gimp, we'll probably fork out 30% of our central funding to stay where we are.

Welcome to the wonderful world of London Broncos sports administration.........

So you are claiming that Broncos will pay more in rent than the Stoop but have nothing to support the claim. I got that bit.

The only part we agree on is with the Hive doing the admin then ticket revenue alone probably wont be enough for TK to see next year as viable.

Nope.....I've shown how much AK could have taken on the gate this year with an 1,250 average including 200 Members, 63 Kids, 62 OAP's, 75 Discounted Hive members, 650 in the cheap seats and 200 freebies per game...it was close to £250,000......my track record in this arena of London Broncos finances shows I am usually within 5%.......but nobody is forcing you to believe me.



Nope......but he is in the box seat with regard to negotiations, as in Hughes and his gimp alienated every other landlord in the region with their insane posturing over 2 years.

By the way, the marketing and administration costs that London Broncos posted in their 2012 accounts came to £750,000. Not sure about the cost of booking a coach to take players to games, sorting out pay-roll or buying a travel card for Buck and Dusty, but I reckon AK's not spent 10% of that this year.......

You're right nothing is forcing me to believe you have a grip on the finances at the Hive. Your obsession with revenue while ignoring costs while at the same time admitting that Broncos have wiped out a large chunk of their admin costs along the way shows me this. The bottom line for this move to the Hive has always been Hughes looking to cut his burden.

1. Not ignoring costs at all. AK knows how much it costs to open the gates.....I have simply shown a scenario where he's taken 250k.
2. Hughes cut his costs alright.........as with most things he touches, he's ed that up too. He's killed the club stone dead.......he's removed any chance of a legacy for his 15 million investment. A fool and his money are easily parted they say and in this case, it would seem so!

So far you have shown many scenarios. Initially over 300k which I described as excessive.

Whatever the figure, it is irrelevant. What matters is what TK expects it to be next year and whether after the cost of hosting the Broncos he thinks the deal is worthwhile.

23k a game on the gate per game delivers 300k. That's at 18.40 a ticket.......I don't see that as excessive at all, but have instead skewed the scenarios to a more realistic 250k/15 quid a fan. AK apparently thinks that based on 2014's numbers, 2015 on the same model isn't for him, which points to us having to pay the man rent.........if 15 quid a ticket average, where the range of prices (other than pensioners and kids) is 16-25 notes a pop isn't enough for him, then it points to the club having a similar if not greater rent bill than they had in 2012.

Yes I think we've got that bit. TK appears to have decided that in 2015 ticket revenue less costs is insufficient to make it worth his while if stories are to be believed and so an alternative will need to be arranged.


No it doesn't.
It's an argument you'd like to be true but the figures you supply prove nothing with regards to how much benefit the Hive will derive from having the Broncos stay next season and how much revenue TK has determined is necessary to make it worthwhile. imo you are just repeating an unsupported assumption and constantly repeating it does not make it true.
It's a broken record that the Stoop rent + admin costs & marketing - ticket revenue made a loss and contributed ZERO to the playing budget so to now claim that Broncos not paying rent, admin costs or marketing and forfeiting the ticket revenue in exchange is a poor deal is a joke. On multiple occasions you have compared the ticket revenue at the hive to the rent at the stoop while choosing to ignore the costs broncos no longer pay and the Hive now cover out of that revenue, it is a completely false argument.