They are allon here tonight ,its like a Rugby version Bullseye,lookwhat you could have won , this gets better , im going for a LIE DOWN before the serious deep thinkers arrive .

RL isn't a profitable sport though Jonny. The Governing body makes a profit, as do a handful of clubs, but that's it!

Hence why RFL love the "Benefactor Model" as it gives the illusion of profitability. As the saying goes, how do you make a small fortune out of rugby league? Put a big fortune in!

If every club made a loss they would all fold. The RFL post year on year profits. Okay rich businessmen run RL clubs, but they do in all sports.

Just because that is the ' norm ' , it doesn't mean we should just accept it ? , all clubs cannot and will never bring in a rich benefactor , it is part of the sports governing bodies responsibility to do all it can to make all clubs self sustaining , fortunately we have salary caps that hopefully make it possible for all clubs to achieve break even , many other sports don't have that luxury

The RFL are also posting profits because of the £29m of tax payers money that has been granted by Sport England. Plus they need to do more in the heartlands.

Make no bones about it, there are big problems within the game.

I wonder who will start on minus points next season?

Can't let that go, Dave, it's way off. For a start, the development work is run at cost and is all answerable to Sport England. It has absolutely no part in the profitability of the RFL (though it obviously contributes to the turnover of the RFL). The RFL's profitability comes from increased revenue on tv deals, sponsorship, merchandising and ticket sales, and is after the return of most of it's income to the professional clubs.

As for the investment in traditional areas... And aside from the fact that all bar 7 of the current pro clubs are in 3 counties... The development cash is mostly spent in those same counties. There are more development staff funded in the NW and Yorkshire than in the whole of the rest of the uk put together.

There is an argument to say that is not development, it's consolidation. But, as per the first point, it's because Sport England want more people playing sport... For us that means touch RL and tag RL as much as 13 a side, because that's what Sport England are paying for. And it's a zero-sum game for the balance sheet.

(can't delete a duplicate post in the iPhone, sorry!)

Oh, and the RFL hates the rich benefactor model... It's just that the clubs are independent businesses, and even when the RFL sets up a salary-cap framework (that is the envy of other sports) it still can't force clubs to live within their commercial means. But if you think we have problems, look at soccer.

Not what they told Fax Joe , also why give clubs money with the specific aim to attract a benefactor , rather than set up marketing help to attract your average fan

I know you see things that go on that we don't , but the RFL s actions speak more than their words for me

The Crusader fiasco , the fact we still don't know the make up of next season or what clubs are still playing for this season is a complete farce

Sorry , they haven't a clue what the Championship clubs need , even the situation regarding the salary cap infringements only being sorted after 2/3 rds of the following season tells us we are nothing but an afterthought

I await to see what sort of mess they make of Crusaders part 3 , if it involves playing to different rules or payments not all out in the open it will be another knife in the hearts of clubs like Leigh,Fax,Fev

And I hope to god they don't attempt this Anglo French tournament we have heard rumours of

They are indefensible

A profit can be made in the Championship as the article below proves: www.widnesvikings.co.uk/article.php?id=2519 However we have had crowds of 3-4k each week with the odd crowd in the 2k. I'm not sure what rent we pay either as opposed to yourselves. I do know that 90% of all hospitality packages were sold as well this year. A big earner for the club. We also have good corporate partnerships in place but I think you guys have something similar?

A profit can be made in the Championship as the article below proves: www.widnesvikings.co.uk/article.php?id=2519 However we have had crowds of 3-4k each week with the odd crowd in the 2k. I'm not sure what rent we pay either as opposed to yourselves. I do know that 90% of all hospitality packages were sold as well this year. A big earner for the club. We also have good corporate partnerships in place but I think you guys have something similar?

Public accounts for anyone to see if you're not convinced.

Well it is 12 months since those were announced , i'm sure if you've managed similar the Widnes club will be shouting it from the rooftops

purely speculative of course, but I would suggest those numbers are as accurate as a halifax attendance announcement!!!