Since when was this a political forum? I'm all for free speech, but I thought this was a RL forum. Lock this thread and remove any links to party political propaganda. This is all getting very silly.

If being being proud of your nation and having predominanlty socialist views makes you a Nazi in its original form, then yes, they are.

Did he smuggle some Chinese in his suitcase when he came back from his stint in China?

Excellent post.

I would also question what is English tradition anyway?

After all these lands were invaded by the Romans, the Saxons, the Vikings, the Normans - so when push comes to shove we all have some foreign blood in us anyway.

Yes there are social problems, high unemployment (I see enough of this in my working life), crime etc but the BNP in my book isn't and never was the answer.

Vote for them and risk letting in a future like that film "V for Vendetta."

W71, I doubt any reasonable person could disagree with the overall virtues of your posts, however, I get the impression you honestly think [ithere is no problem whatsoever.[/i

Now, I agree with pretty much everything you have said previously about a decent society, but [iI know there is a problem[/i.

I am strongminded and as stubborn as a mule, so not many persuade me into things I dont like, particulalry some halfwitted bigot waving a 'send em back' sign.

But my eyes and ears are open, and like it or not there is a problem.

Denying it and then waxing lyrical about the sins of the BNP or any other extremist group for that matter, is in my opinion burying ones head in the sand and hoping the problem will go away.

If people accepted that our weak immigration policy has created serious social issues, rather than shouting 'Nazi!!' at anyone who dares query it, then it might actually help us deal with the issues properly rather than creating a 'them and us' mentality which is pretty much what you are doing by lumping those know there are problems into the same camp as Nazi thugs.

What I wrote (and with guys like you, Starbug and Mr Chairman in mind) was"a number of intelligent and considered posters on this site have voiced their concerns about the levels of immigration into the UK, the assistance given to incomers while the indiginous population struggles, and the perceived change in the nature and character of our towns.

These are issues of genuine concern to people....
...the concerns that people have are real, and it is important for them to be addressed..."[/i

We don't live in a perfect world. Some of the things needed have been done (Aussie style points system for immigration, compulsory language and cultural tests), and some of the problems are more the result of press scaremongering than of genuine disadvantage to local and prioritising newcomers. But in both perception and reality, there are issues to be addressed...

...but there is nothing in the BNP to offer any hope, support or solution to any of the problems raised. Even dealing with the BNP on thier own terms.. for instance, the BNP website says"ECONOMY - British workers first!

Globalisation, with its export of jobs to the Third World, is bringing ruin and unemployment to British industries and the communities that depend on them. Accordingly, the BNP calls for the selective exclusion of foreign-made goods from British markets and the reduction of foreign imports. We will ensure that our manufactured goods are, wherever possible, produced in British factories, employing British workers."[/i

Now, protectionism of this kind would lead to the ruin of the British economy. Setting up import barriers would do two things... it would make most products we currently import far too expensive for the ordinary person to buy, and it would kill the entire British export trade. It would massively reduce the wealth of the nation, isolate us from the global market, and wreck British economic deveelopment. It would collapse the standard of living in the UK and impoverish us all. There are two economies which operate on this basis... Cuba and North Korea. Anyone want to change places with them?

Here's another oneNORTHERN IRELAND - an end to sectarianism!

Britain has shamefully allowed the terrorists in N.I. to come close to winning when the IRA could have been destroyed years ago. Government weakness has led to hundreds of deaths and given those same terrorists a share in government.[/i

Does anyone really think the Good Friday Agreement, and 12 years of peace in Northern Ireland, was a shameful act by the British Government? Talking with the IRA led to peace and co-operation, unprecedented growth in the province to the benefit of all communities, and the situation now where the former leaders of Sinn Fein-IRA are welcome guests in the line to condemn attacks on soldiers and police officers. The BNP approach would lead only to renewed violence and hatred.

And another oneFOREIGN AFFAIRS - Britain’s interests first!

Britain’s foreign relations should be determined by the protection of our own national interest and not by our like or dislike of other nations’ internal politics. [/i

Hang on, so we'll deal with murderers, torturers, fascists, bigots, communists... anyone, so long as we make a few quid for the nation? Selling guns to Mugabe, then? dealing drugs to Colombia? building prisons for the Iranians?? Foreign policy is complex, and its usually said that there's not enough morality in our overseas relations. Only the BNP could argue morality has no place in global politics. This attitude, for instance, would have led to us declaring a peace with the Nazis in 1941. Our morals have not been untarnished in world politics, nor have they consistently been applied... but were it not for our British sense of what is right, rather than what is easy, then perhaps Europe would still be under the grip of the most evil tyrants of world history. That is just one of the reasons why I say the BNP are the OPPOSITE of British... they are the enemy we have proudly fought against.

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Yes, there are problems, and these are inevitably magnified in times of recession and hardship. But the BNP are part of the problem, not the solution. We'd get a lot further working co-operatively, both within our own communities (of whatever origin) and with our international neigbours nd trading partners, than we ever would stirring up factionalism and building barriers rather than brigdes.

Good post W71.
BNP are not the answer. If you have concerns about immigration don't call at polling station and lazily give BNP a "X" to then give them a chance to spend our tax money and go to thier next frightening step having been given backing by the electorate. If you care and are concerned that much why not put a petition together and see your local mp etc ? Seems lame maybe, but we only have ourselves to blame if MP's don't fear being voted out (ie like Leigh). But Government and MPs are accountable to the electorate.
I think as pointed out the bad apples of immigrants get highlighted a lot more than the lazy/criminal/scavenging so called Brits.
I think also as mentioned, trying to define what it is to be British is near impossible to describe apart from obeying law of of the land type of things etc.

My dad has been forced out of his home because of scum neighbours in his area, and is moving home because of it. They are so called Brits spunging off society.
Problem with a society like ours where we have safety nets for people that are hitting hard times is, people take the p1ss. But what do you do ? You have to have safety net even for the lazy buggers otherwise crime will spiral even more so, or you are hitting the genuine people.

"the BNP calls for the selective exclusion of foreign-made goods from British markets and the reduction of foreign imports"

keywords being "selective" not meaning all and "reduction" not meaning all....... prices wil increase yes on SOME products, but there will be less unemployed people and so in essesence, the tax payers money can be spend on other things rather than people on the dole...... havin industry located within the UK is good as well as products wont be taxes coming in from Asia, making the products cheaper........

out of 15 policies you've picked out 3 that you can critisize........ critisize the immegration policy then i might start taking your side

Most things that most people are writing on here I will agree with. Some I don't. I'd think about voting BNP but know I wouldnt. Some policies are agreeable, some are just downright crazy. We'd be like the Soviets. My point about immigration is this. Can our country support more people coming into this country? The answer is most certainly no.

My wife is pregnant and had an appointment yeterday at the old decripit Leigh Infirmary. Her appointment was 10.15 and finally got to see a midwife, not a doctor, at 12.45. 2.5 hours later. All that with just 2 weeks of her pregnancy remaining.

I have knee problems. Ive been waiting for appointment to see a specialist at Wrightington since the beginning of Feb. I got it yesterday for the 27th April. I count it at 12.5 weeks since my last appointment. Some days i'm in agony. Ive had time off work. My original complaint started in November of last year.

The NHS is bursting at the seems. My wife waited 2.5 hours for an appointment whilst heavily pregant. Ive waited 12 weeks for an appointment. My son cut his head on our weddding night and was sat in A+E for four hours.(Now thats just damned unlucky I know). The system cannot cope with many others coming into this country and using the benefits most of them are entitled to as tax payers.

This is just the NHS. Travel anywhere and you can see that we are bursting at the seems. Been to Asda on a Sunday? Tried to travel to Manchester during the rush hour? Or anywhere for that matter? All our roads are full. Tried to get your child into school? Not easy. Tried to get a council house? There's more chance of me wearing a Wigan shirt.

We all know who these problems have started. Neglect by successive governments. Not immigrants. Our problem is that letting more in will put more of a strain on our services. Labour have failed us. Not just on this but just about everything else. Got savings? Unlucky.

These are the reasons people are now starting to listen to other parties. Tories? Lib Dems? UKIP? BNP? I know that whoever I vote for won't make a difference baecause of where I live. It will be Labour that remains. None of the other parties will even bother putting much effort into this area. They'll save it for the marginal seats. Thats politics I know. We need change. No party offers that apart from the extreme parties and they should really be left well alone. Who left?




I say vote Clarkson