Remember in the years since the new Wembley opened 15,000 club Wembley seats were counted whether they showed up or not, so comparing official attendance figures with previous years is misleading. The final needs to be marketed and sold to Londoners.

I went to the England vs Australia 5th day at OT a few years back when the Ashes were secured and the game heading to a draw. I have been to BSB at Donnington and Oulton Park.

The marketing that appealed was being part of something historic, a great day out, reasonably local, decent price, easy to get to.

I would go to an NFL game at the Etihad or OT. I wouldn't bother with Union, Tennis or Women's football wherever it was.

The point was that even if we graciously add the 16K for club wembley (and remember in previous finals it was hardly as if Club Wembley seats were empty) it's a worrying sign.

Anyone who went yesterday will tell you the whole event was a bit meh.

There's an argument that says plenty of Londoners probably feel the same about the RL Challenge Cup Final.

You make my point for me. The game is dull. You could hear a pin drop at some points in the game at Wembley.

I've just re-watched our 2012 win. We are so far away from that in terms of excitement and falir it's not even funny.

Did you go to Wembley?
I only ask because it doesn't sound like you did.

I accept that up to a point. But my suspicion is that the actual 'quality' of the product is largely irrelevant to the Greater London public and it always has been. They're not into RL, it's as simple as that, you've said you wouldn't bother with three sports in your post, the same applies to them with regard to RL I'd venture.

The reasons that the attendance was particularly low are well-documented, and glaringly obvious to most. That there is some sort of connection being made between the low turnout at Wembley and the game being on its doesn't sit right with me though. I happen to think that RL in general probably does need to do something quite soon about falling attendances across the board, but using the CC final as some sort of bellwether for impending doom all round is logically dubious. The French were hardly going to turn up in the same numbers as Leeds, Saints, Wigan, Hull, almost anyone else tbh. A 50,000 attendance with two 'traditional' clubs in the final would be of far more concern.

Perhaps Catalans getting to the final is a convenient smokescreen for the poor attendance. Perhaps Wembley is too big now for the Challenge Cup and they should take it round the UK to other venues. And perhaps the game is unappealing to the casual punter. All or none of these could be true.

Regardless, there are plenty of commentators saying the Catalans victory is 'good for the game' and others saying the small crowd shows that the game is dying. Which viewpoint is correct, I wonder, as the Dragons being in the final and the low turnout are inextricably linked.

If the RFL had bothered marketing it to get 30,000 extra non RL fans in the stadium they could have entertained themselves, there would have been Mexican waves, people making beer snakes. They could have sung the World Cup song about England's goin all the way. Would have been a great day on the lash.

I doubt they would have seen the rugby league on display and thought "wow I gotta start following Super League now".

Fair points. I would counter with the fact that 85,000 watched Catalans vs Saints in 2007. Take off Club Wembley 16K if you wish (even though that is mathematically suspect as it assumes 0 people sit in club wembley seats).

You say "Perhaps Wembley is too big now for the Challenge Cup" - what on earth has happened to cause this fall from the traditional 80-85k spectacle that persisted for decades?

Yeah yeah. I know there were Warrington fans who didn't go to the game. The number of neutrals was also vastly reduced if the number of replica tops seen in and around Wembley is anything to go by. So we have a dual problem - core support is falling and the game fails to attract new fans.

Anyhow, it matters not. The RFL big wigs are probably doing very similar to those on this forum thread and explaining away the crap attendance and how there was nothing that they have caused, have done or could do to change things. Nothing to see here.

You have to be slightly careful what you wish for though: the rugby 7s at twickenham is marketed pretty well on the tube etc but the result is the ground filled with drunk Australian teenagers in fancy dress not taking any notice of what’s on the pitch, would you want that at CC final?

I personally though the final was a top day apart from the result- had a bit of craic with some French blokes before the game, decent atmosphere considering Wembley was 5/8 full and we performed poorly and then good banter with some neutrals on tube home

Yes RL needs to sort itself out in many areas but had Saints won the semi the attendance would have been much closer to 80k and what we lost in bums on seats we gained in a new name on the cup that has probably brought just as much interest or more than a sold out game between saints and wire

Let's be honest here ,we have core support for RL 200 miles away from Wembley ,rail closures ,road works ,weekend holiday traffic, & if you can find a rail route to the capital ,the prices are daylight robbery. Coach travel of nearly 5 hours to get there & four coming back is thankfully just an occasional experience. Is it any wonder people are not travelling in numbers when they can watch at home in glorious HD ? I'm sure if rugby league was a favourite of the south then it would sell out Wembley every year.

There were 3 mid 20’s men in front of me who were clearly not rl fans. Listening to 1 of them trying to explain to an Irish lad what the rules are...I had to intervene. But the lack of atmosphere at the end I was sitting In definitely led to their attention wandering.

This is a fair point.

How many Warrington fans would have paid all the money and dealt with the logistical difficulties to watch Catalans v another team in the final. Most of us would have been "nah, give it a miss this year, thanks".

can you imagine if the final next season was contested by Catalan v Toronto.rl expansion sounds good on paper,but the reality is these overseas clubs don't bring the speccies through the turnstiles.championship has already noticed this.blackpool bash this year was about 8000 down on previous years.hull kr and Bradford bulls were replaced by Toronto and Toulouse.i also do think the final could also be marketed better.when you get an idiot in charge dave woods saying the cup final is behind the magic weekend in importance are we surprised.thank god they paid him off.