Remember folks if certain people don't like certain people there is the FRIEND AND FOE options, adding to FOE means you don't have to see certain people's posts.

I didn't know this existed. My FOE option has just been exercised. You've just made this board a lot better.

Or we could do what rational people from Planet Earth do and respect opinions that may differ from our own and peoples right to voice them in a constructive, non-confrontational way, whilst reminding ourselves that we're all here for the same reasons and we all want the same outcome.

That obviously only applies to wires fans, the rest of em can kn*b off.

To be fair, I don't actually think there has been that much of an over reaction on here - Yes, there have been differing opinions on what's going wrong, or where we could have done better on the recruitment front, but, unless I've missed it, I've certainly not seen any 'Smith out' calls on here.

It may seem fickle to some, but despite the great things that Smith has done at Wire, when things go a little awry, then surely its only right that people should question, within reason, what is happening?

Personally, I think the worst thing we can do is simply put the blinkers on and come out with stuff like ISWT - We should stay behind the team on the terraces, but on sites like this its only right that people can point out the bleeding obvious, like the form of several players, who should be doing better, and whether its realistic to believe that this present squad can turn their form into something resembling trophy-challenging form.

Not for the first time you took the words out of my mouth

I don't have a choice

I've not read the ten page thread, but it's obvious we need a couple of years of rebuilding to get back to the level we were at a couple of years ago. I'd rather see Tony Smith doing that rebuilding than anyone else who is currently available.

This season is a write off, and the next couple might be as well, but if Smith fancies it then we'll get back to challenging again before long. We could even end up at Wembley this year if the winners of Leeds V Sants draw Wigan along the way and we avoid them 'til the final. I accept we'd probably lose to one of those three in the final, but the day out itself would have seemed like a dream when Smith took over but now it would be a scant consolation.

That's thanks to him and the expectation he has created. Don't even think about letting him go.

See, now Uncle Rico (grandma called and say you should go home btw) thats all fine and dandy if the participants are all working to the same rules, however when you get people/persons who are 'wrong' and i do mean 'wrong wrong' as in, not based on anything anyone else accurately remembers like that, it gets peoples backs up. Especially if those people/persons constantly post repeatedly in that style to no benefit whatsoever and it seems that they're posting purely for the sake of it, which is covered in the AUP under thread spamming and post count increasing. it also gets peoples backs up.

Think about it this way, you ever tried to play chess against someone thats not trying to win? its bloody infuriating, downright awkward and spoils the game, and i think that's whats going on here.

Some people just like to hear the sound of their own keyboard, and put anything.

and we have a winner.....

Whilst i agree with Dropkick that smith deserves a bit of time due to the success he has brought to this club, i also believe that if the owner thinks there is somebody out there(and they don't have to be 'available')who can take us on to better things then the success he brought us is irrelevant. Between 1996 and 2006 saints sacked three coaches who had won both the championship and challenge cups. This kept them at the top. If we are honest, we have been the best side in Super League for the last three years and we still haven't won the title. It might sound harsh, but until smith delivers it(and he certainly won't this season)then he has failed in my opinion.

That's an interesting point.
Even the staunchest Smith fan would find it difficult to put up an argument.

When you put it like that... Smith has indeed failed as the target for the cup has always been to win SL.

Its a very good point and if he was to stay for the next 3 or 4 years and still not deliver the SL title, then I think he would have to go down as a failure, despite the Challenge Cup successes.

However, to look at it from another angle, over the last 5 years there have been 10 major trophies on offer - Wigan have won 4 of them, Leeds 3, and we have the remaining 3.... That's very good company to be in and nobody else has won a bean, bar the pointless League Leader's Shield, so from that aspect we should be very proud of what we have done under Tony Smith.

Personally, I think the biggest disappointment is that we definitely have had the squad to have won at least one GF.... The ironic thing being the side which was edged out of a final appearance in 2011, was a much better side than either of the two that did the make the final - That semi final defeat to Leeds, for me, was the biggest disappointment of all, far more than the GF defeats, simply because that side were the best team in the league by a distance and got done by a very canny Leeds side - That particular defeat perhaps showed that Tony Smith isn't the genius that some have him down for.

If the club had had the vision to appoint Shaun Wane as Wire coach when he was Wigan assistant I wonder how different recent history would have been.