As the 3rd best team in a group of four we are going to be targeted by the 4th best and adding to this the traditional animosity that the home nations show towards England, we were inevitably on a hiding to nothing.

I am hoping that this weekend's game against the Aussies will be an epic between a team that has to win & a team whose sporting mentality says they must inflict the heaviest defeat possible on any opponent called England or GB.

I do too. The differance between us n them is Thurston Smith n inglis I think we can match or handle the rest.
I'd like to see ratchford Williams n gale at FB n hb respectively. I cannot see us grinding them down so we need to look to our creative players rather than the organisation of widdop or the support running of lomax at full back.

I think Australia will win comfortably on Sunday.. We have a decent forward pack but just don't have the firepower in the backs to worry them, add to that we will be playing in a friendly Sunday afternoon atmosphere in London rather than a raucous partisan one in somewhere like Wigan or Hull with a Saturday tea time kick off ... Sorry but i think the Aussies will stroll home.

Let's face it, with an aussie coach in charge the best we are ever going to be is a poor copy of the aussie style of play, which at best is effective but as dull as ditchwater, and at worst just makes us look mickey poor against a team like scotland.

The spark has been coached out of English RL and until teams start playing like us circa 2011 or the saints teams of old then we are never going to be a challenger to Oz & NZ. We can't beat them playing the same style of rugby as them, we have to do something different

Perhaps a starting point Ms S would be to throw Ratchford into the halves & see what individual plays he can come up with. The lad deserves a chance if only from the bench.

Rows and rows of empty seats on show again I suspect.

Anyone think that the Aussies may go easy on Sunday? Surely they'd prefer England in the final as opposed to New Zealand

There can't be just us two that think this Shirley?

Watkins - not playing well enough
Sarginson - not good enough
Gale - Not good enough
Hodge - Not playing well enough
Clark - Not being played right
Sam Burgess - Trying far too hard
Twins - Not playing well enough

Soon as Hill and Graham are off the field our middle looks weak. Gale is proving that the sky hype train are wrong about him. He is no way good enough for test rugby. Lomax has been pretty solid at full back. a few missed tackles but his positioning has also saved us from conceiving a good number of tries. The Convicts will rip us a new on this weekend. hard up the middle and their back line will run riot.

Decent summing up.

Lomax has had his knockers I (oooer missus) but I agree with you he looks like he was born to play FB

Do the Burgess brothers come as a pack of three ? I think the twins inspire me less than would Cox & England being included in the team.

i have felt a bit sorry for liam watts watching the Burgii' being inneffective

Taylor deserves a shirt ahead of either Tom or George. Widdop looked a far better player when paired with Smith. Matty may not set the world on fire but his guidance and in play kicking saved us in the test series against the Kiwis. He's solid and gets the job done. I'd like to see Ratch feature but I cant see him being picked and can't see him being any more effective than Gale in the halves. At a push I'd put him a centre. Watkins is world class but after the season Leeds have had I can (sort of) see why he's currently playing the way he is. Percival had a good game IMO and should be a sure starter over Sargenson. Like him or hate him but Farrell also HAS to start in the back row. Whether that's at the expense of Bateman or Whitehead I'm not sure. I'd be inclined to take him over Bateman.

If we don't think Watkins will improve, is it worth playing Bateman in the centres instead? Which side did he play centre at Wigan?

I think we'll see Williams and Widdop this weekend, Widdop hasn't really impressed me that much but without him we were shocking.

Also on a Four Nations note if not England, I'm still in awe of that try by Russell... We need to get the ball out to him on the edges more often!