Newer balls are designed for better handling in "summer" rugby. The problem with some of them have been that the shpae of the surface is not only better to grip, it itself grips water. Older balls were basically replaced as basically when they got wet, they became heavier and also misshaped.

The old rounder, 8 panel "super league logo embossed" ball was the grippiest ball I've ever had the pleasure to play with. Can't comment on the new ones unfortunately, but when both teams are coughing up that much ball, questions have to be asked

The who out muscled who and the who made most errors pails into insignificance for me, we keep spouting about how good the halfbacks are and yet we didn't have an end of set plan we just hoofed the ball up field and hoped for the best. This was the case last week at Stains, but last week we won and it papers over the cracks.

Gidley and Sandow can be wonderful with their attacking kicks but without the end of set defensive kicks we invite excessive pressure, this has to be addressed.

On another note when will Smith and Agar coach the team to build pressure before trying the wonder passes which end in us loosing possession?

The problem on Friday thought was that we very rarely got to the end of the set in order to put an attacking kick in. Does anyone know what the completion rate at the end of the game was? Id be surprised if either team achieved 50% or more.

Every set where you are not attacking the line should have a structured end even if its the only set you complete all match!

Couldn't agree more, i just don't think we got to a point in many sets where the structured end was used.....the ball was all too often lost, penalty given, knocked on etc etc before the kick became an option.

Having said that, the few attacking kicks we put in, if only for field position, i thought were pretty good, especially when Sandow was chasing each one down like a man possessed.

I think it wad 54% and 57% completion rates to Wire and Hull respectively. Appalling stats.

How many sets did we throw a silly offload or just cough up possession on tackle 1 to 3 in their 20m area? Must have been seven+ occasions and i think we bombed three on tackle 1 within 10m of their line.

Quote: BuckleyStreetWire "I think it wad 54% and 57% completion rates to Wire and Hull respectively. Appalling stats. How many sets did we throw a silly offload or just cough up possession on tackle 1 to 3 in their 20m area? Must have been seven+ occasions and i think we bombed three on tackle 1 within 10m of their line.'" For me, this video www.skysports.com/rugby-league/w ... MaEkQjfByU is a perfect summary of the handling skills on the night. Something was certainly up. Sneyd just wouldn't normally miss like that, and you'd expect Clark to pick it up cleanly as well.

Quote: BuckleyStreetWire "I think it wad 54% and 57% completion rates to Wire and Hull respectively. Appalling stats. How many sets did we throw a silly offload or just cough up possession on tackle 1 to 3 in their 20m area? Must have been seven+ occasions and i think we bombed three on tackle 1 within 10m of their line.'" For me, this video www.skysports.com/rugby-league/w ... MaEkQjfByU is a perfect summary of the handling skills on the night. Something was certainly up. Sneyd just wouldn't normally miss like that, and you'd expect Clark to pick it up cleanly as well.

although i cut your quote to suit my agenda.... i do wonder about this sometimes.

When we signed Gidley, i imagine it went like this on the first day

TS - gday gidderz.. so, know any decent attacking moves? if so, care to teach this rabble in training?
CG - well erm.....
TS - nice one... OI Richie, what we practicing in training today mate?
RA - erm...... <scratches head>....... Charge downs?
TS - lovely lets get cracking

I don't think that we lost a lot of possession through throwing the ball about too much. Gidley was pinged for crossing twice. Currie was dragged into touch and lost the ball straight from a tap penalty. Ormsby came up with a couple.
Last week against saints we had 3 chances in the first half and scored on each attempt. Westerman and Clark just had to catch a ball and we would have been 12 points better off.
I do think there was a couple of spells where if we had better ball security for 3 or 4 sets that Hull would have started to fade. They had a lot of big units and turning them around was starting to cause them trouble but a small error like I have mentioned above let them off the hook.
I remember the challenge cup semi against Leeds at Langtree Park and errors cost us the game. We just couldn't build any pressure and that was similar.
I hope that was just a one off and we learn just to respect possession a bit more for the odd spell because big sides like Hull and catalan will get tired.
Fair play to Hull fc though. They remind me a bit of Bradford from 15 years ago. Massive pack and huge wingers who take a lot of energy to put down. I don't think they were massively creative but will take some stopping if they stay injury free.
A lot of our game plan relies on smaller blokes running at big tired forwards (Clarke, dwyer, ratchford, sandow, Russell) but we never made Hull defend enough to see them start to drop off tackles.

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Ridiculous!!

Sandow what fit hasvbeen great kicking!!


We didnt get to the end of enough sets!!

Hull were exceptional defensively, we didn't look capable of getting over the line. Hull have used the old Bradford Bulls blueprint to perfection, build a massive pack, creative halfback with great kicking game, then fill the three quarter line with loads of big powerful backs. They murder you when they get in the 20.

Hull's pack isn't particularly big, it's just there is a lot of quality in there. taylor and pritchard are the only big forwards. They do seem to be particularly well conditioned and we've won plenty of games in the last 15-20 minutes of late.

As for smaller blokes running at tired forwards, I'll counter yours with sneyd, tuimavave, shaul and houghton.

2 well matched teams on Friday in appalling conditions. Hull's forwards gave them the edge and nullified wire's better half backs IMO

What?

On reflection, if our skills were better on Friday night ,we would have won playing the Warrington way , whether playing the Warrington will win us anything other than friends .is another question